No on prop 8

[sweetxcandyxashy]

Seriously.
It's discrimination against gays.
So what if they teach it to kids?
They need to learn someday.
It doesn't influence them to be gay.
It just tells them there are gays in the world.
So it goes against the bible?
Since when did California run on a theocracy?
Not everyone believes in God.
Is it that hard to get?  

[Ayniu]

I voted no on 8.
I myself am not bi or homo, but I think it's messed up to try to control other people's lives if they want to do something. =/

 

[Midnight Phase]

Hm, I voted yes, but that's just my opinion. I don't hate people that are gay or anything, I just don't really agree with it. I don't like to force my opinions on others though, everyone has a right to their opinion. Which I'm glad that everyone has a different opinion, because it would be pretty boring if we were all the same.  

[Zephyrkitty]

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Hm, I voted yes, but that's just my opinion. I don't hate people that are gay or anything, I just don't really agree with it. I don't like to force my opinions on others though, everyone has a right to their opinion. Which I'm glad that everyone has a different opinion, because it would be pretty boring if we were all the same.

I'm curious: can you please explain how telling someone 'I disagree with gay marriage, so I won't allow you to marry' is not forcing your opinion on another person? I respect your right to have an opinion (although I may disagree with it), but I don't see how those two statements are anything less than contradictory.


Personally, I thought that this video summed up my thoughts on it pretty well, but said it better than I could have. Denying one group the right to marry is discrimination, and I have faith that Prop 8 (and similar bills in other states) will either be voted against in a future election or found unconstitutional very soon.  

[Midnight Phase]

Yes, you are right ... it is contradictory and I will admit it since it is (I find it dumb when someone is a hypocrite and denies it). Though, I was thinking more on the terms of: I am not forcing my opinion on others since I am not telling anyone to go out and vote yes. I am one person and there are many others that may or may not choose the same choice I did and I will have no affect on what they chose. I will be in the count, yes, but so will everyone else that is either or. Those were more of the terms I was leaning on.
I couldn't watch the video, my internet is lame. It is discrimination, yes, but for personal views/reasons I keep hold of my opinions.
I am glad you respect my right to have an opinion as I do yours.
Of course, (many people like to say that what I'm about say can't work that way, but it does), I do not personally hate a person that is gay. I have many friends that are. I just do not agree with their actions, sort of speak, as one would not agree with a friend that is doing something that you do not agree with, to say the least (whether it be negative or positive or whatever). I do not go out of my way to hate them or anything. They are people and people will be people. You cannot adore and love everything about a person (even lovers may have at least on thing that they don't like about the other person).
I hope that I answered your questions.  

[Zephyrkitty]

A word of warning: this is something I feel very strongly about. I'll try to keep a cool head, but I apologize if I say anything needlessly rude or harsh.

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Yes, you are right ... it is contradictory and I will admit it since it is (I find it dumb when someone is a hypocrite and denies it). Though, I was thinking more on the terms of: I am not forcing my opinion on others since I am not telling anyone to go out and vote yes. I am one person and there are many others that may or may not choose the same choice I did and I will have no affect on what they chose. I will be in the count, yes, but so will everyone else that is either or. Those were more of the terms I was leaning on.

Fair enough. I don't really have anything else to say about this.

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I couldn't watch the video, my internet is lame.

There's a transcript on the page, if that helps.

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It is discrimination, yes, but for personal views/reasons I keep hold of my opinions.

Is there any chance you might expand on these reasons? I don't usually get to hear why people are opposed to gay marriage beyond 'I don't agree with homosexuality', and I think it would be helpful for me to hear more from the other side.

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I am glad you respect my right to have an opinion as I do yours.

Same here.

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Of course, (many people like to say that what I'm about say can't work that way, but it does), I do not personally hate a person that is gay. I have many friends that are. I just do not agree with their actions, sort of speak, as one would not agree with a friend that is doing something that you do not agree with, to say the least (whether it be negative or positive or whatever). I do not go out of my way to hate them or anything. They are people and people will be people. You cannot adore and love everything about a person (even lovers may have at least on thing that they don't like about the other person).

While I understand where you're coming from, I'm not sure if it's quite as applicable. Homosexuality is caused by genetics, so it's less of disliking some of your friend's personality aspects and more of disliking something that they can't change. It's like hating someone being girl or a boy; they can't change it, so why are you holding it against them?

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I hope that I answered your questions.

I've asked a few more here, but I think you've answered most of them otherwise. Thanks!  

[Midnight Phase]

You're welcome, I must thank you for not riding me as most would.

My main reasons are that I believe there was a reason God/higher being/creator made it that a male and a female together can make a child naturally while two males/females cannot and that for most it comes naturally to love one of the opposite sex (most would say that isn't a very good reason, but it is a reason I feel strongly about). That is my main reason, some of my other reasons I have been kind of rethinking on so I am unsure of their status at the moment. Though, love is love, this is true, and religion shouldn't have affect on the outcome of a state's choice of gay marriage or not.

Though, I have to admit that since I recently gained a close friend that is gay, I have loosened up my opinions on this. I used to be extremely against it for much more reasons, but I have let up on them. Possibly I may just need more time to analyze it by both sides. Normally I am one to look at a situation from both sides, but I wasn't on gay marriage for the longest of times. Now that I am, it is possible for change.

Hm, I believe that being homosexual is a choice for some, but for those that it is in the genetics, I guess that you are right and that I shouldn't hold that against them. Maybe I should look at both sides, thank you for pointing this out to me. I may not be completely for gay marriage at the end, but I will open up more.  

[Zephyrkitty]

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You're welcome, I must thank you for not riding me as most would.

No problem. Anger doesn't seem to work all that well in small guild debates, and I'm not an angry person to begin with.

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My main reasons are that I believe there was a reason God/higher being/creator made it that a male and a female together can make a child naturally while two males/females cannot and that for most it comes naturally to love one of the opposite sex (most would say that isn't a very good reason, but it is a reason I feel strongly about).

My problem with this line of reasoning is that, while religion is a fine reason to hold a certain view, separation of church and state makes it a bad reason to make this belief law. So while you can certainly say that it's against your religion, a secular reason would be better when trying to argue whether or not it should be legal.

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That is my main reason, some of my other reasons I have been kind of rethinking on so I am unsure of their status at the moment. Though, love is love, this is true, and religion shouldn't have affect on the outcome of a state's choice of gay marriage or not.

When you decide how you feel about them, tell me. I'd love to hear more reasons.

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Though, I have to admit that since I recently gained a close friend that is gay, I have loosened up my opinions on this. I used to be extremely against it for much more reasons, but I have let up on them. Possibly I may just need more time to analyze it by both sides. Normally I am one to look at a situation from both sides, but I wasn't on gay marriage for the longest of times. Now that I am, it is possible for change.

This is definitely a differing point between us. I've always been pretty nerdy, and I don't think any of the girls that I hang out with at college are straight. XD I was also friends was a gay boy in high school (and I know another one at college), so I had to decide my opinion on it then.

I can relate to the second part, though. It's not the case now, but there are a few issues where I held one view for a long time without even trying to examine the other side. However, I started trying to find out why the other side holds the view that they do, and on some of those I've decided that my original view was best, while on others it's changed entirely.

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Hm, I believe that being homosexual is a choice for some, but for those that it is in the genetics, I guess that you are right and that I shouldn't hold that against them. Maybe I should look at both sides, thank you for pointing this out to me. I may not be completely for gay marriage at the end, but I will open up more.

Please don't. Most GLBT didn't choose their sexuality, so blaming them for their situation doesn't do anything to help.

I highly recommend looking at both sides of the issue. Regardless of which side you end up deciding is right, knowing why both sides believe the way they do will only strengthen your opinion on the issue.  

[Midnight Phase]

Yes, I've been thinking about that too. Religion definitely shouldn't conflict with law, and I've always thought that. I guess it never occured to me about gay marriage until recently. I'm glad that it did though.

I always have found that look at both sides is the good thing, and most of the time I do that, but of course, we are only human and sometimes stubborness gets the better of us.

Thank you for the small debate, it was satisfying and interesting. 8D We all need some insight sometimes and I think I did for this situation.  

[Fatgirl and Robin]

Sadly I'm not old enough to vote, but if I was, I'd defiantly vote no.
I have a gay friend (who's moving to England! D'= -cries in corner-) and I have a friend who I think is gay but I don't know him well enough to ask.
I personally get really mad whenever people harass either of them.
:l
I used to be against gay marriage, but after I met Alex (my gay friend), you know, I don't really care what gender he likes. It's his life and I want him to live his life to the fullist and be happy. He's an amazing guy and he deserves to be happy.
I'm a strong believer that everyone should have the same rights, no matter what color, age, gender, sexuality, religion, etc.
We are all humans so I don't see why we should deny certain people rights just because they are different.
:l
Also, I don't see why everyone makes such a big deal over something such as sexuality. It's like, okay, yeah, they like guys/girls, so? What's it have to do with you?
A strong belief of mine: Love is love, no matter what form it is in.

 

[GabrielleClearwater]

Ugh. I was so mad about that.
I know a bunch of gay/bi/les people there scream  

[AThousandLullabies]

everyone says it goes against the Bible.
how??
i've read the Bible, and i don't see anything saying being gay
or having a gay marriage is wrong  

[Zephyrkitty]

AThousandLullabies

everyone says it goes against the Bible.
how??
i've read the Bible, and i don't see anything saying being gay
or having a gay marriage is wrong

Loki has a fantastic thread on homosexuality and the Bible. He mentions a lot of the verses used to claim that homosexuality is a sin there.  

[Azusanga]

I'm assuming prop 8 was gay marriage?
If people don't explain things, I won't know them. I don't read the paper or watch the news, I'm sick of hearing all this s**t about how so and so got shot and died, and how so and so's wife stabbed them with a bottle, and about how so and so's house is on fire ._.

My base is that: Sexuality should not play a role in laws. We have allowed women to vote. We have allowed them to rise to higher powers that they could have only dreamed of before (whether we voted for them or not is a different matter). We have allowed African Americans and others of other 'minorities' (damn I hate that word) to do things that Caucasians can do as well. Why the hell can't we let homosexuality be allowed within these nations? Our skeletons remain the same, and we are all made of the same matter and atoms. The only difference is gender preference ._. we are so shallow.  

[Zephyrkitty]

Satin_Slippers

I'm assuming prop 8 was gay marriage?
If people don't explain things, I won't know them. I don't read the paper or watch the news, I'm sick of hearing all this s**t about how so and so got shot and died, and how so and so's wife stabbed them with a bottle, and about how so and so's house is on fire ._.

Prop 8 was a proposition on California's ballot last year. It was about adding an amendment to the constitution to specify marriage as between a man and a woman. It passed, which was really disheartening since California had made gay marriage legal earlier that year.