Dr. Who - a show for the truly decrepit

[Velouria Dragoon]

AmberKatt

Harbone

Fine. Okay.
Here's a controversy:

Was the Sylvester McCoy stuff really like a Cheap Country Pantomime?

There is a reason why most of the plots were so abysmal for the Sylvester McCoy episodes. The guy in charge overall (the head of the Beeb? The head of their department of the Beeb? I can't remember exactly what his position was....) hated the show, and wanted desperately to kill it, but it was too dang popular both in Britain and overseas. So he sacked the whole crew of writers/editors and brought in a new bunch from the British soaps arenas, people who knew very little to nothing about science fiction series writing in general and Dr, Who in particular. He wanted to make the show so bad that its ratings would dive, thus giving him an excuse to cancel the show.

The fact that it survived as long as it did even after his sabotage shows how much we Whovians loved our Doctor, in spite of any attempts to kill him off. And in spite of big letter-writing campaigns (in the States at least; I don't know about Britain) to keep the show going, he finally did succeed in getting it cancelled.

For a while, at least.

evil  

[Umberella]

I liked that era of shows, but I can see that they were totally different from old Doctor Who. They're not really that bad (We got to see the Daleks walk up stairs!) but they seem to have alot going on. It's not just the Doctor helping somebody. It's the Doctor running around and helping somebody, fighting villans, bossing people around, getting attacked.
Actually that sounds about the same.
Maybe it was just too much physical violence instead of trickery. Ace liked to blow up stuff or beat the crap out of it. Maybe less running through the quarry and more setttings in buildings and basements.
The shows certainly have that glamorous 1980's feel to them. rofl Lots of bright candy-colored villans (Happiness Patrol!) and weirdness (The Greatest Show in the Galaxy). So yay for the good Doctor!  

[Harbone]

Yep. The Sylvester McCoy shows are probably the most postmodern glamrock of all the eras.

Keep in mind, I LIKED the shows. I thought the plots were engaging and topical.

Fast paced is good, in my mind. I liked the frenzied clip at which stories like Ghostlight and Remembrance of the Daleks unfolded. (Even though they can climb stairs, now, they're still the most pathetic scary villains in history! They can't be stopped with machine guns, but you can stop them with a baseball bat... or even better, by putting a hat over one protruding eye! HAHAHAHA! I LOVE the Daleks!)

And I think ALL Dr. Who episodes look like cheap village pantomimes.
Not just the McCoy era. It's like watching a bad monster movie every week with a hero you've come to know and love.

As an ode to anime: Is there any comparable anime villain to the daleks?
The closest I can come up with is Jinnai and "his" bugrom from El Hazard.  

[Velouria Dragoon]

Ahhhhhhhhhh daleks. Think they're cheesy? Think they're cool? Doesn't matter really. There's no other creature/villan like them. Not anything close. I love them because they're unique and misunderstood. It wouldn't be Doctor Who without them. biggrin 3nodding  

[AmberKatt]

I did like some of the Sylvester McCoy episodes: "Remembrance of the Daleks," "Battlefield," and "Survival." I really liked how the women kicked butt in "Battlefield," too. wink (And especially the new female Brigadier, and how that knight became her devoted boytoy after she beat him in a fight. *g* ) I also liked how the writers/prodicers didn't then knock the women back down with "The Fatal Female Flaw," which so many shows and movies inflict upon strong female characters. The Brits are notorious for that, but we Americans do our fair share, too.

The other episodes had lots of silliness, lots of "cute," but there was still a lot I liked about them too. And I always did like Ace -- like Leela, she could take care of herself; she wasn't a helpless screaming female. Of course, being a Companion, she did need to be rescued here & there, but it was treated the same as when the Doctor rescued male companions, not as "oh the helpless victimized girl" thing that most of the other female companions had to deal with.

Did anyone ever read the novels that came out, The New Adventures of Doctor Who, that picked up with the McCoy Doctor after the TV series ended? Wow, did his character change as those novels went on -- he got really dark, really fanatic, and actually not very trustworthy.... But there were some really good novels in that series, and in the others that came out for the previous incarnations (The Lost Adventures....) I stopped reading them years ago, because they started coming out with four new novels every few months in each series, and frankly I couldn't afford to keep up with them. But I have quite a few still in my personal library.  

[Velouria Dragoon]

ok...

I don't want to create spoilers for anyone. So it might be better to reply to this in a pm. Did anyone else download and watch the Christmas Invasion? I am interested in hearing other opinions on it.  

[Hairy Priest]

I saw the Christmas Invasion (and also Attack of the Graske). Haven't seen Eccleston's stuff yet, so I can't compare, but I loved Tennant's version of the Doctor. The story itself has a few plot holes that one could nitpick at, but the real strength of the story was in the witty dialog and excellent acting.

And we even learned a little more about the regeneration process. smile  

[Velouria Dragoon]

Hairy Priest

I saw the Christmas Invasion (and also Attack of the Graske). Haven't seen Eccleston's stuff yet, so I can't compare, but I loved Tennant's version of the Doctor. The story itself has a few plot holes that one could nitpick at, but the real strength of the story was in the witty dialog and excellent acting.

And we even learned a little more about the regeneration process. smile

I still don't understand why they brought the doctor into the house... wouldn't it have been so much better to take him back into the TARDIS right away? I just didn't get that at all... Still don't. So, he ended up being dressed like that and I kept thinking of Arthur Dent as I watched the Doctor.

Can't put my finger on exactly what it is,t the episode was awesome, but it just didn't feel like Doctor Who to me... not precicely...

I'm a huge fan of Harriet Jones. I hope we see her in more episodes.  

[Catira Norr]

Haven't seen Eccleston's yet either. My friend keeps promising me a Who night while I'm here in the UK, but I guess with Christmas...

Anyway, at least I saw Christmas Invasion in the UK (Dad wasn't too impressed with the interuption to Christmas dinner though). I definately like the new Doc, a bit manic, but witty,even down to his Arthur Dent comment, and I liked the "six little words" bit at the end.

I can tell that his assistant is going to bug me though she just doesn't seem to have a brain.  

[Velouria Dragoon]

Catira Norr

Haven't seen Eccleston's yet either. My friend keeps promising me a Who night while I'm here in the UK, but I guess with Christmas...

Anyway, at least I saw Christmas Invasion in the UK (Dad wasn't too impressed with the interuption to Christmas dinner though). I definately like the new Doc, a bit manic, but witty,even down to his Arthur Dent comment, and I liked the "six little words" bit at the end.

I can tell that his assistant is going to bug me though she just doesn't seem to have a brain.

I fully understand why you say that she doesn't have a brain. If you would have seen the missing season (eccleston's episodes) then you wouldn't have this opinion quite as strongly as you do. I mean she really does have a brain, its just so steeped with western culture that it doesn't know what to do in some circumstances... She really has the guts to do something instead of nothing, and I like that about her. (even if that something does fail miserably from time to time.)

I think she's ok, but then agan I'm American. I suppose if my first impression of her was a kid in a bubble gum commercial who says "pop" I might have a different impression of her altogether.  

[Hairy Priest]

VelouriaDS

Can't put my finger on exactly what it is,t the episode was awesome, but it just didn't feel like Doctor Who to me... not precicely...

The comedy level, perhaps? Although I found myself laughing at most of the humor, it did strike me as being something you didn't see that much of in seasons 1-26.

VelouriaDS

I'm a huge fan of Harriet Jones. I hope we see her in more episodes.

First I saw of her... she was enjoyable (although that whole "Harriet Jones, I'm the Prime Minister", "Yes I know who you are" thing kind of made her look silly). Given her actions at the end of the story, I'm curious to see where they intend to go with her character.

No second chances. neutral  

[Wendigo29]

Tom Baker was probably my favorite Doctor, though I haven't seen it in years.

I did see him on an episode of BlackAdder the other day.  

[Velouria Dragoon]

Wendigo29

Tom Baker was probably my favorite Doctor, though I haven't seen it in years.

I did see him on an episode of BlackAdder the other day.

"is that a canoe in my pocket, or am I just happy to see you?" (yeah, I know that wasn't Baker's line, but its from that episode and very funny... I love Black Adder.)  

[AmberKatt]

Wendigo29

Tom Baker was probably my favorite Doctor, though I haven't seen it in years.

I did see him on an episode of BlackAdder the other day.

Tom Baker in a BlackAdder episode??? LMAO!!! rofl rofl

Which series, and which episode?

(I saw him in a Remington Steele episode ages ago, but his character, a baddie, was terribly one-dimensional. Only other series I remember seeing him in was in that British serialization of The Chronicles of Narnia... he played Puddleglum the Marshwiggle, in The Silver Chair. Perfect for the role, although seeing Dr. Who in dreadlocks was a rather unnerving experience... lol....)  

[Wendigo29]

AmberKatt

Wendigo29

Tom Baker was probably my favorite Doctor, though I haven't seen it in years.

I did see him on an episode of BlackAdder the other day.

Tom Baker in a BlackAdder episode??? LMAO!!! rofl rofl

Which series, and which episode?

(I saw him in a Remington Steele episode ages ago, but his character, a baddie, was terribly one-dimensional. Only other series I remember seeing him in was in that British serialization of The Chronicles of Narnia... he played Puddleglum the Marshwiggle, in The Silver Chair. Perfect for the role, although seeing Dr. Who in dreadlocks was a rather unnerving experience... lol....)

Let's see......it's Blackadder II, the episode is called Potato. His characer is called Redbeard Rum.