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Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 6:46 am
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Posted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 4:14 pm
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Posted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 4:28 pm
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Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 12:57 pm
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Posted: Sat May 17, 2014 12:18 am
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Posted: Sat May 17, 2014 8:32 pm
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I really didn't like reading replies in this thread. I'm sorry that, clearly, some of you have been exposed to man-haters or false feminists.
Feminism IS GENDER EQUALITY.
It has the name derived from feminine/female because it was a movement started long, long ago when men went to war and women stepped up to take up those jobs. Back then, it was women being equal. But now, in the modern, 21st Century, we have Third Wave Feminism. This is truly gender equality. It is not only telling society that is okay for a woman to fit stereotypes and it is equally okay for her to break all of them, but it is also saying that telling men to "man-up" is wrong because it implies it is a masculine trait to have strength, consequently suggesting that women are weak.
Again, I'm sorry that some of you don't understand feminism, or at least real feminism. But feminism is basically a movement begging society to treat women as people. I suggest you all go to YouTube and look up Joss Wheadon talking about feminism, because he truly understands it.
He actually put it in an easy way- "I start thinking about the fact that we have this word when we're thinking about race that says we have evolved beyond something and we don't really have this word for gender. Now you could argue sexism, but I'd say that's a little specific. People feel removed from sexism. 'I'm not a sexist, but I'm not a feminist.' They think there's this fuzzy middle ground. There's no fuzzy middle ground. You either believe that women are people or you don't. It's that simple." [x]
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Posted: Sun May 18, 2014 8:53 am
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well, feminism is supposed to work towards gender equality, yes, but it's a movement for women-- in short, only works on issues (real or not) that affect women. men's rights activism is equality forwarding for men (basically, feminism for men)-- in short, yes, you're right, but no, you're also very wrong.
also, there is no "false feminists." if they identify as feminist, they are a feminist. it's that simple. and third wave feminism (aka this feminism, like you said) is what's pushing people away. femen, "men can't be raped," "1 in 4," and telling women that they're constantly oppressed by a "patriarchy" is the problem, and it's what's pushing people away. if feminism did what it said it was doing, maybe i would still be one. it would also help if feminism actually updated their facts- 1 in 4, like i said previously, the wage gap (many, many studies and economists have proved it wrong-- the bureau of labor statistics is one of them), and things like that, for starters.
but even then, it's a big, big maybe. knowing what i do now, the "no" option is a lot bigger than the "maybe" option for me. a lot.
also, i'd argue joss whedon doesn't get it. he's saying that because i'm not a feminist, i'm sexist and believe i'm less than my brother, my father-- which isn't true. i may not be a feminist, but that doesn't mean i'm not any less of a person than they are, nor that i believe women are inferior. we're all people. i believe women are humans, i believe men are humans, and i believe we all are created equal. however, that doesn't mean feminism. that means i possess common decency towards people. (i do also think that legally, not so much equal- however, it's not laws the majority of the time that cause the inequality.)
in fact, i'd also argue that feminism is partially making women feel that they're inferior-- when i was a feminist, i felt like every man was out to get me. why? because i believed that they all would dismiss me if i was raped, assaulted, or anything, that we lived in a patriarchy (we don't), and so on. it wasn't healthy (not to mention my gigantic victim complex fueled by feminism), and since i've left, i've realized that no, all of that is false, and i've not felt like a victim over nothing since. x
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Posted: Sun May 18, 2014 10:32 am
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I disagree. Feminism is a movement for everybody. :/ I know a lot of male feminists and they all agree it affects everybody.
Feminists are not the ones saying men can't be raped. They are the ones saying they can. I know they can, my friends know they can, real feminists know they can. It's the false feminists (yes they really do exist) that disagree with that. It's these women I always see on Facebook talking about hating men and falsely accusing ex-husbands/ex-boyfriends of rape for more child support that are spreading false feminism. It's that simple. There was a snapshot (with the name and pic colored out, of course) somewhere in my files. Someone'd taken snapshots of these and labelled feminism when it is not.
Well, Joss believes that feminism = gender equality and if you don't want gender equality, then what can you possibly want?
Feminism has been referred to by feminists as common sense and common decency as well. Because feminism is a movement to get everyone to treat everyone as human.
I'm sorry that that was your experience. That sounds horrible, living in fear of men. And I do realize that some people spread that idea. But it's not what feminism is, truly. I used to feel like that too until I got some different feminist friends and influences. You should not be afraid of men; no one should be. Feminism is supposed to mean that not all men are rapists with urges they can't control, and women are not always the victim. I'll admit that the idea of feminism has been skewed over the years when its taken a jump in popularity.
I'm not asking you to become a feminist again, but I really hope you'll get a different idea of what it really is.
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Posted: Sun May 18, 2014 10:48 am
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i never said men couldn't be feminists, i said that it only worked on women's issues, and not men. movement for women =/= men can't be a part of it.
and really? i've heard them say that 95% of men are rapists, and that they couldn't be raped b/c they're men, and not women. they are saying that. and like i said, there's no "real" feminist. anyone who says they are a feminist is a feminist. it's that simple. "false feminists" don't exist. i hate to break it to you, but that is feminism, no matter how much you'd rather it not be.
well, i and over 5 billion people are not joss. and oh wow, i never said i didn't want gender equality, i am all for equality! but never ever, would i be a feminist.
and how has it been referred to by people who aren't feminists, by people who couldn't care less about feminists, by your "fake feminists," and so on? it's not just your "real feminists" that count. and like i said, it's a movement for women's rights, not for gender equality for men and women. egalitarianism is defined as for equality for both men and women.
yes, well, i was. and now i'm not, look at that.
and i know you're not, i simply wanted to state my opinion at you, as you have a very clearly defined, strong opinion. x
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Posted: Mon May 19, 2014 7:20 am
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loonaboots i never said men couldn't be feminists, i said that it only worked on women's issues, and not men. movement for women =/= men can't be a part of it.
and really? i've heard them say that 95% of men are rapists, and that they couldn't be raped b/c they're men, and not women. they are saying that. and like i said, there's no "real" feminist. anyone who says they are a feminist is a feminist. it's that simple. "false feminists" don't exist. i hate to break it to you, but that is feminism, no matter how much you'd rather it not be.
well, i and over 5 billion people are not joss. and oh wow, i never said i didn't want gender equality, i am all for equality! but never ever, would i be a feminist.
and how has it been referred to by people who aren't feminists, by people who couldn't care less about feminists, by your "fake feminists," and so on? it's not just your "real feminists" that count. and like i said, it's a movement for women's rights, not for gender equality for men and women. egalitarianism is defined as for equality for both men and women.
yes, well, i was. and now i'm not, look at that.
and i know you're not, i simply wanted to state my opinion at you, as you have a very clearly defined, strong opinion. x
Um. Feminism has always been about gender equality since its inception. How'd about doing the research before opening your ignorant mouth. I know I know. You think you know it all and think egalitarianism sounds cooler and makes you look smarter but no.
Seriously. Stop. Feminism is needed for a lot of things including the institutionalized misogyny that you keep showing.
Its fine to have an opinion but not when you're trying to portray it as fact. Now I want you to turn around and back up your claim with academic sources or you can stop.
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Posted: Mon May 19, 2014 4:15 pm
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um. i never said it wasn't about gender equality, i said that it only focuses on women's issues. how about instead of telling me about my "ignorant mouth," you learn to read and stop telling me how to research, mmkay? i know, i know, you think you know all and that you're supreme. i bet you think badmouthing me makes you look really cool and smarter but no.
(and i don't think i sound smart, i think i'm stating an opinion.)
"institutionalized misogyny"?! oh my god, do you spout that out to everyone who disagrees with you?! let me tell you, you're showing more of that good old "institutionalized misogyny" by telling me i'm inherently sexist for not conforming to your ideas of what a woman should believe in.
also, answer me this: why would a woman want to be part of a movement that would shame her for having different beliefs and not being a feminist if they weren't a part of that movement? hmm? i'm waiting, ms. smarty.
and where did i say i was trying to portray it (aka my opinion) as fact?
oh, you want sources? i can do that:
Quote: "and i know you're not, i simply wanted to state my opinion at you, as you have a very clearly defined, strong opinion." (me, in the reply that you quoted; paragraph 6).
but where, oh where, do my opinions need academic sources? where?
on top of that, do you want me to back up the fact that there's over 5 billion people who aren't joss whedon? look in the mirror, look through random facebook searches, look through censuses, photos- there's your proof. do you want proof that feminists don't care about men's issues? with buzzwords like "institutionalized misogyny" that you throw around, i'm willing to bet your tumblr is chock full of them. besides my opinions, the stuff like that which i've said don't need sources.
on top of that, opinions don't need sources. shocking, right? i know, i got the wind knocked out of me when i learned that.
but, you're right, i've said that the wage gap doesn't exist. so, by all means! argue it up with the u.s. department of labor.
it's fine to have an opinion but not when you try and shove it down someone's throat. now i want you to back up your claim with academic sources, or you can stop.
i'll be waiting right here. x
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