respecting mothers

[whatagirlwants]

So I was talking to my grandma on the phone today and the subject of my mother came up. I tried to divert the conversation but she went on about how even if my mom isn't perfect and I get my feelings hurt I need to see her and let her see my son and stop getting my knickers in a wad. People say stupid stuff they regret...yada yada yada. I asked if a friend had treated me the same way if she would expect me to still be friends with that person. My grandmother instantly said that mothers weren't the same as friends and I knew it. What it boils down to is she thinks I should respect my mother and let her see me and my son as often as wants just because she's my mother. But the woman treated me like filth, she doesn't love me, she is just using my assertiveness to get attention.
discuss..

Does giving birth instantly entilte you to motherhood?

Just because you gave birth to someone does that mean you deserve their undying love and devotion?

Are you entitled visits from your grandkid even if you aren't a very good mother?

Should a daughter respect her mother no matter what?

Basically is my grandmother right any shape way or form about this?  

[Hester Peche]

Yes giving birth does entitle you to motherhood--if you choose to accept it. Love is a two way street, you have to give a little to get a little...And you should always respect your mother, and not just your mother everyone. Just because someone hurts you doesn't mean you have to hurt back.
And if she's a good grandmother, then she should get to visit. Grandmothers are different than mothers--my nana was a terrible mother but, she's a fantastic grandmother.

Also...Just throwing this out there it is one of the 10 commandments to "honor thy father and mother", I'm not particularly religious but it's something I follow.  

[broken_bleeding_angel]

Does giving birth instantly entilte you to motherhood?
Not necessarily. You may have given birth, but that doesn't always entitle you the role of "Mother". If so then surrogate mothers and adoption agencies would reign hell. I know my father's mother may have given birth to him, but she never raised him. My great nana (whom I was named after) raised him and his youngest sister. All his mother cared about was how she looked, what people thought of her and whether or not her husband and eldest daughter were happy. So my vote is no.

Just because you gave birth to someone does that mean you deserve their undying love and devotion?
No. Sure you brought them into the world and everything, but if they don't love you unconditionally then it's just not going to happen. People don't change unless they want something.

Are you entitled visits from your grandkid even if you aren't a very good mother?
Again, no. My family had this situation when I was a baby and my parents didn't want my grandparents to see my older sister or me any more. (They physically and psychologically abused my older sister). So they took my parents to court for this and won. Legally they are, but if you don't feel they should then don't.

Should a daughter respect her mother no matter what?
I think respect should go both ways. If you can't do both then why bother? If that relationship isn't balanced with mutual respect then it's not going to be a very good relationship.

Basically is my grandmother right any shape way or form about this?
I say no. She's disrespecting you by trying to push you to together, which will only bring more resentment. Her aim might be for the good of your relationship with your family, but she's meddling in your personal affairs that should be left between you and your mother. And if your mother is running around crying to everyone about you then shame on her. She's acting like a 5 year old who's not getting her way so she's trying to get you in s**t with the rest of your family.

froggymama89

"My grandmother instantly said that mothers weren't the same as friends and I knew it."

Mother's are your best friend, your worst enemy, your protector, your role model, your advisor, your confidante.
If they treat you like s**t then they're not a mother. They're just somebody you had to put up with/live with for most of your life.  

[iDorkosaurous_Rex]

I agree with broken_bleeding_angel.
My father had the same problem with his grandfather. His father treated him like crap, his 5 brother and sisters, and his mother all his life. And he still has the scars to prove it, but now that my father has children and a wife he always wants to talk to us. When ever he talks to me or my sister or brother he just starts to talk badly about my dad. He also calls my dad on holidays and gives him a list of people to call. He doesn't even call to wish him a happy birthday, but my dad does the opposite. He keeps giving and gets nothing. Infact my grandfather is rich and is always inviting people for things, and then tells my dad about it. I can see my dad does not like talking to him or even seeing him. So I say if your mother is anything like this, why bother?  

[AriaStarSong]

Does giving birth instantly entilte you to motherhood?
No. Many women who are physically capable of carrying a fetus in their wombs are not suitable mothers. This is one of the many reasons that social services is in existence, and why adoption exists.

Just because you gave birth to someone does that mean you deserve their undying love and devotion?
No. People need to be viewed and evaluated on an individual basis as to whether they "deserve" undying love and devotion, or, more importantly, respect.

Are you entitled visits from your grandkid even if you aren't a very good mother? "entitled" is a tricky word. I'm going to say no, but I'm going to add more at the bottom.

Should a daughter respect her mother no matter what?
The answer to this is no, but is so situational that it really isn't fair to answer. Do I think a child who is physically or sexually abused by their mother needs to respect them? No. Do I think a girl who is mad at their mother because they won't let them go clubbing on a school night should respect her mother's decision? Yes.

Basically is my grandmother right any shape way or form about this?
In general, no, but I think she does bring up some good points.

I would encourage you to try to work out some sort of relationship with your mother. Just because someone was a bad mother, doesn't mean that they'll be a bad grandmother, the two roles are very very different. Your mother may also regret some of the decisions that she made with you as a child, and may want to make up for that now. I don't know your exact situation, so I can't say what you SHOULD do, or what you HAVE to do, but I would encourage you to try to come up with some sort of arrangement where she can be at least somewhat involved in your son's life. Does that mean she can see him whenever she wants? No. Not in the least. That is subject to YOUR schedule and abilities, but grandparents can be very important in a lot of people's lives. If you can, try to find a way to work things out in a manner that is acceptable to everyone involved.  

[whatagirlwants]

Thanks everyone and keep it coming. I think my Grandmother is just worried about the family as a whole. She worked very hard when my mother was doing this to my aunt to keep the family from tearing apart and it must hurt her to see it happening again. I feel sorry for her because she's in the middle of all this my mother is trying to use her against me and what I say and my mom say contradict and it hards to pick child or grandchild on who to believe. I think she might be saying the same thing to my, I don't know.

Aria, My mother puts forth no effort to get along with me and I have tried it is very clear that she wants the grandson without the daughter. The only way she's satisfied is if we're her all worshiping slaves. The only way I'm satisfied is if she treats me like a human being, no more that like her baby girl ya know because that is what I am. Any tips on how to work around that would be loved.  

[LyricalSoul93]

I'm gonna start this by saying I've read a fair bit in various threads about the relationship with you and your Mum, so I know you're not just being petty. I'll answer these questions but I honestly think I'm going to have a hard time putting myself in your shoes because my mum is basically my best friend and I really have no concept of what it would be like to not get on with someone in your immediate family.

Does giving birth instantly entitle you to motherhood? Anyone who gives birth to and then raises a child or participates regularly in that child's life without permanently damaging them is a mother in my opinion. If you give your child away in a closed adoption and never try to contact them again (which I'm not saying is necessarily a bad thing) you haven't earned that title, and if you abuse your child as he/she grows up and don't take responsibility and change you don't deserve it. But those are extremes, most mothers basically mean well for their kids and don't deserve to be judged since motherhood is such a difficult gig, and such a personal one.

Just because you gave birth to someone does that mean you deserve their undying love and devotion? No. Some parents and kids just don't get along, you can't force it.

Are you entitled visits from your grandkid even if you aren't a very good mother? Yes, in most cases I think so. Grandparents play an important role in a kid's life if they have that opportunity, and I think Grandparents who have good wishes for their grandkids should be allowed to see them, even if they didn't quite get it right the first time (assuming the parents are sure their child will be safe with the grandparents). After all, the way I see it that particular relationship isn't about the parents, it's about the Grandparents and the kids, who should be allowed to make up their own minds about eachother.

Should a daughter respect her mother no matter what? Every person deserves respect on a basic level. Respecting someone doesn't mean you should do everyone thing that person says, just that you should consider their feelings as well as their own. A mature adult daughter/son has the right to make his/her own decisions, but they should still consider how they are affecting their parents, because they will always be a part of their life.

Basically is my grandmother right any shape way or form about this? As I said before, I've grown up in a very tight family, and it's polarising. You really can't understand how anyone could not be close with their parents. Maybe that's how your Grandma feels?

I don't know, I feel that it's important to make a pretty darn big effort to like your family, even if it isn't easy (You only get one after all!) and family sercurity networks are very strong. Having said that, if you and your Mum honestly just make eachother miserable by being in the same room, then why bother? You'd both be better off without the stress.  

[Tirissana]

1) No giving birth does not entitle you to being a mother. It takes a lot more than simply giving birth to be a mother. To be a mother you have to love and nurture your child. To raise it. And to not harm it phsyically, psychologically, mentally or emotionally. My mother was never really present in my childhood as she usually dropped me off at my grandma's house so she could work. To this day I have never really considered her my mother and our relationship has suffered greatly during my childhood.

2. Nope.

3. It depends on how you afflicted your child. If you have abused your child in any way possible. Then no you are not entitled to seeing your grandkids. There is a such thing as pattern of behavior and there is a chance that you can do the same to your grandkids as you did with your children.

4. No. Respect is earned not gained. If you want respect you must earn it. It's not free. And no one is entitled to it.

5. I don't know. My grandma knows I don't get along with my mom and she knows my relationship with my mom is bad or really non-existant. She knows I don't neccessarily love my mom or respect her. Anyone who mistreats their child shouldn't deserve any love or respect. So in a sense your grandma may need to take off the rose colored classes and understand that.  

[whatagirlwants]

Ace I see what you are saying and I know it must be very hard on my grandma. She doesn't know why but my mom is just somone who has to have an enemy before me it was my aunt who did noting to deserve it though my mom thinks she did. I intend to follow my aunts lead because it works well for her. I think maybe when my son is old enough to see his nana without me...like old enough pee and make a sandwich on his own...and if he wants to, to let him.  

[Kaiyle Brightblade]

If she gave birth to you she is your biological mother and your son's biological grandmother. Nothing in the world can change that she is a blood relative of you and your son. But as a grown woman you have the right to make decisions about the kind of relationship you have with your mother. You no longer owe her undying respect and obedience. If you think she can have a better relationship with your son than she had with you, then maybe you should let her see him. I'm sure he wants to have a grandma in his life. This is what your grandmother meant by "mothers are different". Your relationship with your friends does not affect your family much. Your relationship with your mother will. But if you don't think she can be a good influence in your son's life, then sever your ties with her.  

[Pom Graines]

If someone isn't respecting my boundaries, if they are being emotionally or mentally abusive, if they do not respect me in general... then I am prepared to cut ties with that person. Blood is not so thick that one should stick to an abusive relationship (in the general sense of relationship, not romantic obviously). I know that things had gotten so bad for me and my family I very nearly cut all ties from them, it was quite the wake up call for them and things have changed dramatically in our relationship since then- which is really a good thing, because I didn't want to cut them out but I couldn't stand having my boundaries broken any longer. But things changed and are healing, so yay.

Anyways, for your questions:
Does giving birth instantly entilte you to motherhood?
I would actually say yes to this. However if one becomes abusive (mentally, emotionally or physically) then the child could, and should, be removed from the situation if he or she is too young ot stand for themselves, or the child should walk away from the relationship if he or she is an adult. Again: blood does not give one the right to control and abuse and disrespect.

Just because you gave birth to someone does that mean you deserve their undying love and devotion?Absolutely not.

Are you entitled visits from your grandkid even if you aren't a very good mother?
No. The child isn't that of the grandparent and should not automatically be entitled to see the grandchild if the parents of the child do not want the grandparent to visit. Again it comes down to boundaries and such. However, it is good to note that a lot of people treat their grandchildren different than they treated their children to one extent or another, they tend to mellow out with grandchildren more. While this is no where near always the case, it's at least the tendency in the grandparents that I have observed.

Should a daughter respect her mother no matter what?
No, as every other relationship it needs to be maintained and respected from both ends to function. Respect and trust can be broken, and once they are they are hard to get back.

Basically is my grandmother right any shape way or form about this?
I can see where she is coming from in her perspective and I can empathize with what she's saying.... but overall I would say not. You deserve to be treated well and with respect, if you are not then you are not entitled to return that respect and wellness to your mother just because she birthed you. Healthy boundaries are really the key here so that you do not get enmeshed with your parents and realize that they've done a lot for you, but that does not entitle them to do whatever they want to you and expect to be treated well as a result.

And as far as the "My grandmother instantly said that mothers weren't the same as friends and I knew it." comment goes...

All relationships are of equal footing. Break someone's boundaries, abuse and use them and it's not a healthy relationship and for the sake of all involved needs to either change drastically or end right then and there. Just because you were born to someone, doesn't mean they own you for all of your life and it doesn't mean they are entitled to anything having to do with you (including your child).  

[Matron Mord Sith]

I still respect my mother even though she can be a bit unreasonable at times. I love her but there is this wall between us. I refuse to actually get close to her until she realizes some of the things she does is wrong.

Case one: I will never forgive her for this but there was this one time, I was 10 years old and I accidentally left a math assignment at school in my desk. Mind you, my mother isn't a very forgiving person. I lied to her that I had no home work which wasn't a big deal because I remember the assignment was only 5 problems and I could have easily gotten it done before class started. Why I didn't just tell the truth you ask? Like I said, shes unreasonable. She used to ground me for the silliest of reasons. Yes, she would ground me for three months just because I forgot something. Not just taking away t.v grounding, basically the only thing I was aloud to do while bring grounded was sit in my room. I wasn't aloud to leave unless I had to use the restroom.

Well, anyways, she found out that I lied and naturally she flew off the handle. She grabbed for the fly swatter. Note, it wasn't those plastic ones either. It was a metal wire one. She grabbed a hold of me and then proceeded to beat the s**t out of me with it. The dumb b***h didn't realize that she was flogging me with a piece of metal. Even though I screamed at the top of my little lungs for her to stop, she continued. I even fought back by biting and kicking. Still didn't stop her, she continued the beating til she was out of breath. Once she was done with me, I went to the bathroom shaking and crying. I was wearing little overalls and the inside of them felt wet. I took them off and found blood stains all on the insides of them. Even though I was wearing jeans, the metal fly swatter left several deep cuts all up my legs, butt, and lower back. Later that night I showed her the cuts and she blamed it all on me. If I wanted to, I could have shown my teachers at school the wounds. Part of me really wishes that I did show my teachers.

Case 2: She likes to threaten my little brother that shes going to kill him because he couldn't find something up stairs for her.

Case 3: She likes to swear and scream at me a lot. Mostly over stupid things.

She does things like this all the time. Every time I try and talk to her about it she gets defensive and believes that she hasn't done anything wrong. Still to this day she refuses to say sorry for beating me with out mercy and leaving cuts all over my body. I hate my mother but yet, I love her. I really don't understand our relationship. I can't believe her when she tells me that she loves me. Part of me also wants to flog her with a piece of metal and make her feel pain.  

[whatagirlwants]

Matron Mord Sith

I still respect my mother even though she can be a bit unreasonable at times. I love her but there is this wall between us. I refuse to actually get close to her until she realizes some of the things she does is wrong.

Case one: I will never forgive her for this but there was this one time, I was 10 years old and I accidentally left a math assignment at school in my desk. Mind you, my mother isn't a very forgiving person. I lied to her that I had no home work which wasn't a big deal because I remember the assignment was only 5 problems and I could have easily gotten it done before class started. Why I didn't just tell the truth you ask? Like I said, shes unreasonable. She used to ground me for the silliest of reasons. Yes, she would ground me for three months just because I forgot something. Not just taking away t.v grounding, basically the only thing I was aloud to do while bring grounded was sit in my room. I wasn't aloud to leave unless I had to use the restroom.

Well, anyways, she found out that I lied and naturally she flew off the handle. She grabbed for the fly swatter. Note, it wasn't those plastic ones either. It was a metal wire one. She grabbed a hold of me and then proceeded to beat the s**t out of me with it. The dumb b***h didn't realize that she was flogging me with a piece of metal. Even though I screamed at the top of my little lungs for her to stop, she continued. I even fought back by biting and kicking. Still didn't stop her, she continued the beating til she was out of breath. Once she was done with me, I went to the bathroom shaking and crying. I was wearing little overalls and the inside of them felt wet. I took them off and found blood stains all on the insides of them. Even though I was wearing jeans, the metal fly swatter left several deep cuts all up my legs, butt, and lower back. Later that night I showed her the cuts and she blamed it all on me. If I wanted to, I could have shown my teachers at school the wounds. Part of me really wishes that I did show my teachers.

Case 2: She likes to threaten my little brother that shes going to kill him because he couldn't find something up stairs for her.

Case 3: She likes to swear and scream at me a lot. Mostly over stupid things.

She does things like this all the time. Every time I try and talk to her about it she gets defensive and believes that she hasn't done anything wrong. Still to this day she refuses to say sorry for beating me with out mercy and leaving cuts all over my body. I hate my mother but yet, I love her. I really don't understand our relationship. I can't believe her when she tells me that she loves me. Part of me also wants to flog her with a piece of metal and make her feel pain.

say by some freak chance you were to have a child and kept it and she wanted to her grandkid more than she did would you let her? would you let her alone with him even if the rest of your family said you were unreasonable?

This is kinda where I am. In my earliest clear memory I was 2 1/2, tried to get out of my top bunk bed and slipped between the bed and window head first. My tooth went thought my lip. I remember very clearly being in emence pain but not crying because I was afraid of my mom. all memorty before this foggy, flashes of fear and pain. I tried to discuss this with my mom and she flipped out. I tried bringing this up with Gma and she changed the topic. I do know that I had to have been abused in my early years. For this reason along with the sheer neglect she observed the one time I trusted her I don't let her be alone with froggy.  

[Matron Mord Sith]

froggymama89

Matron Mord Sith

I still respect my mother even though she can be a bit unreasonable at times. I love her but there is this wall between us. I refuse to actually get close to her until she realizes some of the things she does is wrong.

Case one: I will never forgive her for this but there was this one time, I was 10 years old and I accidentally left a math assignment at school in my desk. Mind you, my mother isn't a very forgiving person. I lied to her that I had no home work which wasn't a big deal because I remember the assignment was only 5 problems and I could have easily gotten it done before class started. Why I didn't just tell the truth you ask? Like I said, shes unreasonable. She used to ground me for the silliest of reasons. Yes, she would ground me for three months just because I forgot something. Not just taking away t.v grounding, basically the only thing I was aloud to do while bring grounded was sit in my room. I wasn't aloud to leave unless I had to use the restroom.

Well, anyways, she found out that I lied and naturally she flew off the handle. She grabbed for the fly swatter. Note, it wasn't those plastic ones either. It was a metal wire one. She grabbed a hold of me and then proceeded to beat the s**t out of me with it. The dumb b***h didn't realize that she was flogging me with a piece of metal. Even though I screamed at the top of my little lungs for her to stop, she continued. I even fought back by biting and kicking. Still didn't stop her, she continued the beating til she was out of breath. Once she was done with me, I went to the bathroom shaking and crying. I was wearing little overalls and the inside of them felt wet. I took them off and found blood stains all on the insides of them. Even though I was wearing jeans, the metal fly swatter left several deep cuts all up my legs, butt, and lower back. Later that night I showed her the cuts and she blamed it all on me. If I wanted to, I could have shown my teachers at school the wounds. Part of me really wishes that I did show my teachers.

Case 2: She likes to threaten my little brother that shes going to kill him because he couldn't find something up stairs for her.

Case 3: She likes to swear and scream at me a lot. Mostly over stupid things.

She does things like this all the time. Every time I try and talk to her about it she gets defensive and believes that she hasn't done anything wrong. Still to this day she refuses to say sorry for beating me with out mercy and leaving cuts all over my body. I hate my mother but yet, I love her. I really don't understand our relationship. I can't believe her when she tells me that she loves me. Part of me also wants to flog her with a piece of metal and make her feel pain.

say by some freak chance you were to have a child and kept it and she wanted to her grandkid more than she did would you let her? would you let her alone with him even if the rest of your family said you were unreasonable?

This is kinda where I am. In my earliest clear memory I was 2 1/2, tried to get out of my top bunk bed and slipped between the bed and window head first. My tooth went thought my lip. I remember very clearly being in emence pain but not crying because I was afraid of my mom. all memorty before this foggy, flashes of fear and pain. I tried to discuss this with my mom and she flipped out. I tried bringing this up with Gma and she changed the topic. I do know that I had to have been abused in my early years. For this reason along with the sheer neglect she observed the one time I trusted her I don't let her be alone with froggy.

If I do ever change my mind and decide to have children, I don't want her to be alone with them. I'm going to make it very clear to her that if she tries any of the same bull s**t she pulled with me as a child, I will hurt her. Mother or not shes not going to hurt my kids. I'll enforce this with violence if I need too. Yes, I will physically assault my own mother.

Shes part of the reason why I don't want to have kids. Part of me is so afraid that I'm going to be a horrible authoritarian parent just like my mother. No kid deserves to go through what I did.  

[whatagirlwants]

Matron Mord Sith

froggymama89

Matron Mord Sith

I still respect my mother even though she can be a bit unreasonable at times. I love her but there is this wall between us. I refuse to actually get close to her until she realizes some of the things she does is wrong.

Case one: I will never forgive her for this but there was this one time, I was 10 years old and I accidentally left a math assignment at school in my desk. Mind you, my mother isn't a very forgiving person. I lied to her that I had no home work which wasn't a big deal because I remember the assignment was only 5 problems and I could have easily gotten it done before class started. Why I didn't just tell the truth you ask? Like I said, shes unreasonable. She used to ground me for the silliest of reasons. Yes, she would ground me for three months just because I forgot something. Not just taking away t.v grounding, basically the only thing I was aloud to do while bring grounded was sit in my room. I wasn't aloud to leave unless I had to use the restroom.

Well, anyways, she found out that I lied and naturally she flew off the handle. She grabbed for the fly swatter. Note, it wasn't those plastic ones either. It was a metal wire one. She grabbed a hold of me and then proceeded to beat the s**t out of me with it. The dumb b***h didn't realize that she was flogging me with a piece of metal. Even though I screamed at the top of my little lungs for her to stop, she continued. I even fought back by biting and kicking. Still didn't stop her, she continued the beating til she was out of breath. Once she was done with me, I went to the bathroom shaking and crying. I was wearing little overalls and the inside of them felt wet. I took them off and found blood stains all on the insides of them. Even though I was wearing jeans, the metal fly swatter left several deep cuts all up my legs, butt, and lower back. Later that night I showed her the cuts and she blamed it all on me. If I wanted to, I could have shown my teachers at school the wounds. Part of me really wishes that I did show my teachers.

Case 2: She likes to threaten my little brother that shes going to kill him because he couldn't find something up stairs for her.

Case 3: She likes to swear and scream at me a lot. Mostly over stupid things.

She does things like this all the time. Every time I try and talk to her about it she gets defensive and believes that she hasn't done anything wrong. Still to this day she refuses to say sorry for beating me with out mercy and leaving cuts all over my body. I hate my mother but yet, I love her. I really don't understand our relationship. I can't believe her when she tells me that she loves me. Part of me also wants to flog her with a piece of metal and make her feel pain.

say by some freak chance you were to have a child and kept it and she wanted to her grandkid more than she did would you let her? would you let her alone with him even if the rest of your family said you were unreasonable?

This is kinda where I am. In my earliest clear memory I was 2 1/2, tried to get out of my top bunk bed and slipped between the bed and window head first. My tooth went thought my lip. I remember very clearly being in emence pain but not crying because I was afraid of my mom. all memorty before this foggy, flashes of fear and pain. I tried to discuss this with my mom and she flipped out. I tried bringing this up with Gma and she changed the topic. I do know that I had to have been abused in my early years. For this reason along with the sheer neglect she observed the one time I trusted her I don't let her be alone with froggy.

If I do ever change my mind and decide to have children, I don't want her to be alone with them. I'm going to make it very clear to her that if she tries any of the same bull s**t she pulled with me as a child, I will hurt her. Mother or not shes not going to hurt my kids. I'll enforce this with violence if I need too. Yes, I will physically assault my own mother.

Shes part of the reason why I don't want to have kids. Part of me is so afraid that I'm going to be a horrible authoritarian parent just like my mother. No kid deserves to go through what I did.

I don't think you would be like your mother because you have become your own idevidual person and you learned what not to do with your kid. Though I will admit I know how you feel. Sometimes I'm afraid to have more because I don't want to spoil froggy and ignore the other kid. I don't think that would happen but I still worry.