[A] Elderhood selections.

[AlexiaSilver]

After looking at all the pretty new elders from the Summer Solstice I became curious about the past elders as well. While looking over some of the past forms I noticed something. There was a small change in one of the forms from the past entries into the newest. Apparently the small difference was enough to allow the Soquili in question to become and elder.

The problem I have is how does a pet fail using exactly the same RPs and then post them adding a little bit extra to the section on the form and then passes? Nothing has changed in the development of the soquili's character, all I can see to be different is the fact the pet is a year older on the cert. Does that mean the age of the soquili is actually more important than the RPs they have participated in? Or is it a factor in some way? I have never seen it written anywhere that a pet needs to be a certain age so I was curious.
I asked a few friends, who entered their own Soqili in these slots why their own Soquili failed. One person told me that an answer they had recieved was among the lines that the Soqili's development had been rushed. Isn't that the point of them getting to 100 percent stats? I don't believe the actual age of the pet should have an affect on their RP age, after all sometimes you just have to go with the flow of things in an RP and that can lead characters to age at different rates. If one person has five RPs and another seven RPs then its likely they have had more time pass, right?

Now don't get me wrong- I'm not saying that any of the winning Elders didn't deserve their eldership. Cause they definitly worked for it! (Yay! 8D) It just worries me that something is coming into play that shouldn't have anything to do with becoming an elder.

tl;dr: If age of the pet is a consideration for eldership then shouldn't it be public knowledge? -since there is a penalty for not passing three times in a row.  

[Dixie]

This is one thing that I would personally like to see addressed.

I know myself and a few others also noted the application stated above and were curious ourself about that outcome.

Now, when I entered my own soquili, I had a feeling the answer would be she needed more outside family rp. The answer I received was the same answer that everyone seemed to have gotten, it didn't help at all. We were told that our soquili was too young and needed more OOF rp. If it's going to be stated that we can ask what to do to improve our applications, it shouldn't be a run of the mill repeat answer to everyone.

Well, here are my two thoughts on this.

1- Cert age shouldn't really be a consideration. This is a rp world after all. Not every soquili grows on the same timeline. While two foals may have been delivered the same day, one's story may have them stay at a foal for some time while the other may fast forward into the future once they become adults. It's not fair to base judgement on the cert age of a pet since the rate of IC growth is not the same for everyone.

2- While I understand that proving oneself to be a leader is an important part of being an elder, why is it a requirement that they -have- to rp with those outside of their family when they could be a great influence to their own? Again, I use my girl as an example. While she would never turn away anyone that was not from her herd if they needed help or advice, BUT, she is not going to actively leave her herd to go find someone to help just to prove she is a leader. Based on the current rules, this says she isn't worthy of becoming an elder which I don't think is fair at all.

Now I don't want it to seem like I'm saying it should be easy to become an elder, because I'm not. It's a privilege that only certain soquili should be able to obtain this status, but I do believe that the current qualifications should have a good look taken to them and the different rp styles and concepts of your owners should be taken into consideration when choosing Elders. From my own group of Soquili, I have 2 right now that I see as Elder material... But the way it stands, it won't happen because they are a herd oriented group. The majority of my soquili would never even be considered for Elder because it's just not in their personality or character to become such, but for the two that I really honestly feel deserve to be elders, I think it's a pity that they will never see that day because they are mainly associated with their family.  

[Syaoran-Puu]

I agree that cert age of the pet should count for nothing (as far as I am aware it doesn't already)... especially since getting to 100% requires roughly 10 months to achieve and even then most pets still need more RP and opportunities to develop a character properly. For Maion it did take much longer XD I got distracted by having a baby -naughty me- hehehe.

As for what makes an elder.... I think there are different kinds of elders in the real world, and so not all soquili should be forced to follow and show exactly the same skills and traits to make it to that possition of honor. Some are going to be more maternal, others more dominate leaders...(etc)... and as such their development will take different courses that need to be considered.

Although I see the advantage of out of herd/family RP, for some characters it is only really an opportunity to have a meet or greet and unless it was plotted so that X could show Y whatever then it is unlikely to have an impact on their leadership skills but more likely just give the X something to think about. I also feel it can lead people to force their characters into situations simply to get them points in the catagory.... when actually if they had plotted it with their family/herd they would have had a better plot and story for their character to show real development.

Just like Dixie and Alexia I am not saying that those who have elders already didn't deserve them -because lordy knows they worked their arses off for them- but it does seem a little off that same RPs used for two applications fails you once and gets you through the next.

I also agree with Dixie that more 'help' would have been nice rather than one line that was general and could have applied to X Y or Z. I know Maion's issue wasn't about not having enough OOF RP but about 'rushing his development' which I still don't completely understand since like with all my RPs I let my characters lead me and that was simply the way Maion led me -I swear he has a mind of his own sometimes XD. *shrug*

Either way I will keep trying and one day Maion WILL be an elder XD I am sure of it! hehehe.

Good luck to anyone trying to build up their characters for elderhood.
And again congratulations to everyone who has made elderhood so far... the new lines are stunning!  

[Sirenz]

Yes there isn't an age rule. The pet must max out stats and be RPed well. That's about the only requirements. biggrin  

[lilmissy4205]

I think part of the concern was the lack of in depth feedback, or I'm just reading too deep with the concerns.

Whenever an artist on DeviantArt wants critique, they want the poster to pinpoint the issue and then give feedback on how to improve. The same is true of writers with editors. So wouldn't it have been fair when giving feedback to Eldership applicants to explain more than just one sentence?  

[EchoLimaFoxtrot]

In terms of "different kinds" of elders, I remember hearing this before (I was really concerned with this).

And the answer I remember seeing dealt with... it all depends. There actually is a huge diversity among the existing elders and how they act. And the roles they each would play are very different. The leadership roles do depend on who they might be geared towards (from what I have seen/heard/etc).

So, a kalona elder if totally possible, but how they might lead would be totally different from a unicorn elder. A lot of this hasn't been dealt with as much, because in terms of the shop, these two breeds are newer than the regulars. But it still applies to personality types and not just species.

And they don't necessarily have to LEAVE the family to be put in to the situation. You can RP with friends who don't have a soquili connected to the family that might travel there. Many travel (I would love to offer some of mine, only one or two are mostly settled but my RPs are pretty slow going and backlogged at the moment) and many are also looking for help with plots in the plot subforum that could have their soquili travel to yours. smile

And if that doesn't work (ie. soquili would run and hide when someone out of the family approahes), then I am sure you can dig deeper for a way to get it to work. It can work! And sometimes, those RP are a BLAST, because you don't know what'll happen (I've had RPs go the complete opposite direction from what I had planned/plotted) xD

As for personality problems, they can work out. I got Nagual-An as elder awhile ago (yes, went through the application process), and I honestly never thought she would grow in to it. I actually DIDN'T want her to be elder because I thought it would destroy her character. But, as it turned out she grew and became elder quality through RPs (that I never saw coming). She was a free-going, happy, naive soquili - couldn't make decisions, couldn't lead a puppy from a bone, etc. Now, she still has many of the same personality qualities, but has matured a great deal smile But she's very different from a stoic, duty-bound, etc, Elder.

It can be done, good luck!!! <3

As for feedback, I have no comment because I never got any. I waited a couple years before I applied for an Eldership because I hadn't felt she was ready and got it so didn't ask for a critique. What I did do was I did ask for "what are you looking for" from the judges during the first application and went from there. This stuff was the same even then, it just wasn't outright published at the time (as it is now).

(side note: a few -very few, not many- of the Elders were made as such before the application process, so their RPs may be very very different)  

[mouselet]

Not every Soquili who maxes out their stats is worthy of being an Elder.

And just because a Soquili has maxed out does not mean they are ready to be an Elder.

And the "penalty" isn't really one as such, given how rare slots are, it's entirely likely that it will be a year just between slots. I don't see how that really makes it so bad.

Four Soquili out of ten applications became Elders last time the apps opened which is rather generous.

I find that pets which have been around longer have a much better chance of having that kind of in-depth development and growth than newer pets.

Lastly, I'm sorry if your answers came out somewhat generic, I've been very busy IRL and will continue to be for the mean time. But still, many of the applicants did have similar reasons for being rejected. I didn't see them being RPed as having grown as much as they could ICly. I didn't see some of them having any kind of leadership roles. Some felt as if they had been sqeezed into a plot and a desire for Elderhood that they just didn't fit.

Some of those Soquili need more time and more RP. Maybe some should never have applied.

The winners were Soquili that have shown growth, have shown leadership, have shown real development and change. Those four were the best entries last time. And like I said, four out of ten is really quite generous. There's no such thing as everyone wins, so quit whining.


*edit* And if customers have a problem with me, kindly take it up with ME first. Don't go behind my back to other staff. It's rude.

Fel: Edited for language. >_>  

[Felmino]

Like any competition, it's not just your own performance, but who you're competing against. It's thus possible for the same elder to win in a second application with minimal change due to the fact that the previous best entries have been skimmed off the top, and no stellar examples have replaced them.

Judging criteria vary by person, but can include:
• RP development
• Leadership qualities
• Well developed personality, non-"Mary Sues"
• Level of activity / participation of the owner
• How long the Soq has been trying to achieve Elderhood

How those criteria are weighted (and that's probably not all of them, just my own best guess) depends on the judges. Generally though older ponies win simply because they've had more time to be developed / have been in the running longer.