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I have a 55gallon tank to work with. And if possible I'd like to keep from using crickets as a staple diet. So something like fruit flies, or meal worms.. which I know are usually smaller tree frogs like an hourglass or clown. I want more than one, what ever kind of frog that I get, however it doesn't have to be an army. Just more than one, preferably. I'd like to have a completely (or nearly completely) naturalistic vivarium.

I have no problem with doing a rain forest setting, however I think it would be kind of neat to have more of a look like it's a piece from my front lawn, if that makes sense. Instead of a Great Stuff background, I could get some siding for a house to put on the inside. For the waterfall, I could have the end of a house gutter, while of course sealing the end of it off with some sort of screen, or by putting metal bars on the inside of it so that they can't go in. (Not that I would expect them to, but you never know.) I could put flower bed edging going down the middle, and have all of the flowers/ferns/etc in the back half of the tank. Maybe a broken clay pot or two. A few normal but small garden decorations like an cherub, or garden gnome or something. Some faux mushrooms. I could use some smooth stones in the front half of the tank like stepping stones.

However that's just an idea I had. And I know that it may be kind of difficult to have a kind of frog that will work with the first things I mentioned, along with how I described my idea for the tank. So, I'm willing to give up the ideas for the tank. But if you could think of something that would work, that would be lovely. I'm always open for suggestions. So please let me know if you think of anything! I'm willing to change just about anything I mentioned. I just don't want to feed crickets as a staple diet. :(

Thanks
-Cassie

It's just as simple as I'm not fond of them. And I don't think my mother would be to happy if they got loose in the house. I know it's sounds stupid because I'm into reptiles and amphibians, but I HATE crickets. Of course, someday I'll have to put up with them, and that's fine. But I'd rather not do that at the moment. - Frozen mice is not a problem what-so-ever. I forgot that someone said you could feed the WTFs frozen mice.. is that true?

Like I said the setup idea I had for the tank isn't a big deal. I can always ditch it. I just thought it would be kind of neat to do something that I could still have real flowers and plants in.. but different from the rainforest setup.

EDIT:
I forgot to mention that I suppose it doesn't really have to be a frog. Maybe something like a walking stick..? Just an idea of course. But no matter what I choose, I'd still like to have more than one. I haven't done any looking into walking sticks what so ever.. so don't shoot me for suggesting it if it's a horrible idea. Just trying to help come up with more ideas since I may be running into trouble with frogs..

Hmm, large tank, you want more than one, rain forest setting, and fruit flies should be a staple? DART FROGS. There are a lot of different species in the hobby and depending on the species, you need anywhere from 2.5g-10g per frog. So for instance if you went with one of the larger more popular species like d. azureus you could have 5 of them or if you wanted something more like (my absolute favorite) d. leucomelas you could safely have quite a few more. PDFs aren't for beginners though, so what type of herp experience do you have?

Well, I've seen people feed WTF pinkies, but I've never fed mine rodents and they don't make a good STAPLE. I'm my experience WTF need to see some movement to be interested in food and would probably not take frozen, but that's my frogs, I can't say for certain all WTF are like that. I also have a Pyxie frog and he eats goldfish and mice. But he's vicious and will eat anything you dangle in front of him, including your fingers. He's not something I would suggest for everyone and he definitely cannot be kept with other frogs though.

I like insects too. I have mantises. I read about stick insects and I'm not sure a 55 gallon would be the best set up. They do best in something tall rather than wide.

I thought of Dart Frogs too, but I also have heard it is not for beginners. And personally if I was going to try keeping dart frogs I would start with something much smaller than a 55. I'd probably start w/ a 20
high or something similar & a pair of frogs. Anything much larger and I would be afraid they would have trouble fining their food which I have seen become a problem with small prey items in large enclosures.

If I had an extra 55 gal and specifically did not want to feed crickets, my FIRST thought would definitely be a Uromastyx but that's A) obviously not a frog B) a dessert not rainforest setup and C) not kept communally

I'm sorry I'm not much help!!!!

Yeah, taller than wide tank suggestion was more for the stick insects than the PDFs. I even keep my WTFs in a normal 29 gallon, neither of them are big climbers. I know you CAN do much larger set ups for PDFs, I was just saying that I think it would be a good idea for a beginner to start out with a smaller set up and one pair of frogs. But a 55 set up for dart frogs could turn out really nice. You'd have enough room for some kind of waterfall/misting system in a tank that size and the whole thing could be not JUST a pet habitat but very ascetically pleasing, a visual focal point to a room. But it's gonna cost a fortune to do. If I had the $$$ I do it smile Your going to need a LOT of fruit flies and you will probably have to make a custom lid for a setup like that. The openings in the screens on the lids they sell in the petshops are too big to contain the flies & other tiny prey.

I think it can be done cheaply enough. The most expensive part, to me, would be the tank, lighting and the frogs. Plants to fill a 55 would be cheap enough at wal-mart or possibly even through e-bay. Substrate is negligible (coconut coir potting soil mixture maybe?) either hardware cloth or plastic grids to make levels on the back and sides (if I were to do it, I would build them all the way up the back and sides so that only the front of the glass is clear/visible) then you could plant the plants at different levels depending on how they do best. To keep the flies from escaping the cage, attach nylons or similar material to a normal "reptile" top? To make a waterfall, I would probably bury a bowl of some sort for the main water reservoir, then use a cheap internal filter of the size that I want the waterfall to be. You would set the tank and the plants up some time before you get the frogs so that everything has a chance to fill in a bit and start the eco-system type set up.

There are other ways to do all of that obvs, but that seems to me to be the cheapest and simplest.

>.< I forgot about the misting system. If one did a waterfall, one would still need that unless they wanted to go in with a spray bottle a few times a day.

LOL your probably right. I kinda suck at the DIY stuff, so I was thinking about the pre-fab waterfalls. Plus, back when I had been considering a set up like that I was thinking of some of my bigger frogs, who tend to drag a lot more dirt & debris into the waterfall and so would need a much more powerful filter system... Now that I stop to think about it the little PDFs probably don't make as much of a mess, so you might not need a big expensive filter.