[SUGGESTION] One more perk for people who RP/Elders

[pippi18848]

I would have to say, I love this idea, if it were to be feasible anyways. My favorite pair, and my first pair, Adelle and Shihab [Kesmi's], have been together since end of '06 beginning of '07. They maxed out on breedings in June of '09. With everything that family has had to deal with due to Neva, and the things that are yet to come, I think it would be nice to in the end, give them one last set of kids, a set of kids they can raise without fear, raise without worrying when Neva will show up to try and destroy them. A great way to end out such an ongoing plotline. So, I personally would love the option of a fourth breeding. Even if you make the requirements insanely difficult and hard to obtain, I would still try for it with the Shidelle pair. <3 I know there are the wishing stars and such, but, it's just not the same as an actual breeding.  

[.Tortured. .Pumpkin.]

I'm going to have to go with a no. If it's for elders only, people will complain because they're so rare. If It's for 100% stats, two RP posts a month for nine or ten months and you're done. If It's through RP, who will judge that? If the best someone is capable of doing is two sentences per post, and they're legitimately trying, are you going to deny them because it isn't of good quality? Or if the Soq you're RPing to get that extra slot has a partner who is infrequent and has a busy life or just doesn't enjoy RPing, are you going to say no because the RP wasn't finished? You have a chance to get three offspring from your Soq. Each of those offspring can bear you three offspring. And that chain just continues. Choose breeding partners carefully and don't fritter them away on flings, and make certain that's what you want for that Soq, and you won't need an extra breeding.
I just think It's kind of greedy, basing everything off breedings. I see stuff in lovers rock saying that to pair with their Soq, yours needs to have all of its breedings. The likelihood of you actually obtaining all three breedings for one pair is ridiculously low, especially when you or the mates owner has nine other couples waiting to enter. I've got multiple pairs where one Soq has three breedings and the other only has two or one. If you like how they go together, breeding shouldn't matter.
/work ramble.  

[Syaoran-Puu]

.Tortured. .Pumpkin.

I'm going to have to go with a no. If it's for elders only, people will complain because they're so rare. If It's for 100% stats, two RP posts a month for nine or ten months and you're done. If It's through RP, who will judge that? If the best someone is capable of doing is two sentences per post, and they're legitimately trying, are you going to deny them because it isn't of good quality? Or if the Soq you're RPing to get that extra slot has a partner who is infrequent and has a busy life or just doesn't enjoy RPing, are you going to say no because the RP wasn't finished? You have a chance to get three offspring from your Soq. Each of those offspring can bear you three offspring. And that chain just continues. Choose breeding partners carefully and don't fritter them away on flings, and make certain that's what you want for that Soq, and you won't need an extra breeding.
I just think It's kind of greedy, basing everything off breedings. I see stuff in lovers rock saying that to pair with their Soq, yours needs to have all of its breedings. The likelihood of you actually obtaining all three breedings for one pair is ridiculously low, especially when you or the mates owner has nine other couples waiting to enter. I've got multiple pairs where one Soq has three breedings and the other only has two or one. If you like how they go together, breeding shouldn't matter.
/work ramble.

Sya agree's with this.

While I must say I have done a plot that involved a breeding to continue (was actually Maion and Sengdroma) it took them about 2 years and a lot of LL links to finally have a colourist take pity and CC them (don't get me wrong, it was worth the wait... but the pets were in limbo all that time, so that was no fun)... since then I have avoided breeding plots unless you can be sure they have a slot and so know babies are coming (aka, you have already obtained a slot). Anyway's this is away from the point of the thread.... haha.

Yes RP is great, yes finding a great couple (especially if it is unexpected) is wonderful... but who are we to judge the efforts of someone else? Who is to say it is worthy or unworthy? I feel this will just add even more pressure to an otherwise loaded crew, and to be honest I would rather see other things happening (mostly regular breedings and customs). It seems unfair and I can see people becoming discouraged and unenthusiased with soquili and RPing rather than the opposite. I know I personally would love to see the RP side of soquili increase (more people to 'play' with is always a bonus!). And taking on Pip's comment... how is a wishing star not the same as a breeding? They start from baskets, they are based on the parents and can even have throw backs should the colourist decide... the only thing that differs is that on their cert they have 'first gen' rather than whatever it would have been and it says 'mock breeding between X and Y'... but IC they are and can be those soquili's children! After all, people customise family members all the time, if we are talking from an RP standing then it doesn't matter what the cert says.... a great plot and story can still be achieved and hold just as much meaning.

/again... personal opinion/  

[Kamiki]

I think simple answer would be allowing Elders a 4th breeding. RP requirements seems a bit redundant since, well, they already had to go through the gauntlet to get Elderhood.

I don't know if I think 100% stats is enough to justify a 4th breeding. /justmyopinion But at the same time, there are Soquili who just aren't Elder material. Doesn't mean they aren't as RP'd or developed, so maybe I'm talking myself out of that. Ha.

Alternatively, or additionally, I think Elders should get 4 baskets by default, as opposed to 3 (/w4th as an option). At this point, I think every Elder breeding has had 4, but imagine how disappointing now it would be to the couple to get 3 baskets do to a stoke of bad luck?  

[pippi18848]

Syaoran-Puu

Sya agree's with this.

While I must say I have done a plot that involved a breeding to continue (was actually Maion and Sengdroma) it took them about 2 years and a lot of LL links to finally have a colourist take pity and CC them (don't get me wrong, it was worth the wait... but the pets were in limbo all that time, so that was no fun)... since then I have avoided breeding plots unless you can be sure they have a slot and so know babies are coming (aka, you have already obtained a slot). Anyway's this is away from the point of the thread.... haha.

Yes RP is great, yes finding a great couple (especially if it is unexpected) is wonderful... but who are we to judge the efforts of someone else? Who is to say it is worthy or unworthy? I feel this will just add even more pressure to an otherwise loaded crew, and to be honest I would rather see other things happening (mostly regular breedings and customs). It seems unfair and I can see people becoming discouraged and unenthusiased with soquili and RPing rather than the opposite. I know I personally would love to see the RP side of soquili increase (more people to 'play' with is always a bonus!). And taking on Pip's comment... how is a wishing star not the same as a breeding? They start from baskets, they are based on the parents and can even have throw backs should the colourist decide... the only thing that differs is that on their cert they have 'first gen' rather than whatever it would have been and it says 'mock breeding between X and Y'... but IC they are and can be those soquili's children! After all, people customise family members all the time, if we are talking from an RP standing then it doesn't matter what the cert says.... a great plot and story can still be achieved and hold just as much meaning.

/again... personal opinion/

Because from the rp/plot point of perspective, the wishing star is not the same as an actual breeding. Sure the kids are still technically their kids, but it's not the same as rping/plotting out the pregnancy. It's like BOOM! MAGIC DUST AND BASKET APPEAR! "Oh hey, it looks like us, we'll take it in. Our wish must of been granted." With Adelle's case, the pregnancy that one would get in a breeding, would be the start of a new life, a new mentality. It would be where she would hash out all her old fears and conquer them. And while she's adopted baskets here and there over the course of Neva's reign, but she's never been able to fully conquer her fears of being a bad mother, and raising corrupt children. With one last pregnancy she would battle those thoughts, and vanquish them completely. Be an amazing plot point for her and one that I've fiddled with from time to time in stories that I've written while at school, but with her being maxed out on breedings, it would never be a plot point for her here. Granted, IF the possibility of fourth breeding ever came around, it would still be a long time before Adelle would even be trying as I still have a few major points to finish up on Neva's side.

And if fourth breedings were brought in, they could be as hard to get as eldership, maxed stats for both partners in the pair, an application process, only offered a couple times a year, etc. etc. just so it's kept rare and hard to get, but it could be a potential for plotters/rper's who have really good plots that could end a certain plot point and be an end of one but the start of another.

Either way, it's completely up to the staff, and whatever the decision I won't mind in the least. 8D  

[Syaoran-Puu]

pippi18848

Because from the rp/plot point of perspective, the wishing star is not the same as an actual breeding. Sure the kids are still technically their kids, but it's not the same as rping/plotting out the pregnancy. It's like BOOM! MAGIC DUST AND BASKET APPEAR! "Oh hey, it looks like us, we'll take it in. Our wish must of been granted." With Adelle's case, the pregnancy that one would get in a breeding, would be the start of a new life, a new mentality. It would be where she would hash out all her old fears and conquer them. And while she's adopted baskets here and there over the course of Neva's reign, but she's never been able to fully conquer her fears of being a bad mother, and raising corrupt children. With one last pregnancy she would battle those thoughts, and vanquish them completely. Be an amazing plot point for her and one that I've fiddled with from time to time in stories that I've written while at school, but with her being maxed out on breedings, it would never be a plot point for her here. Granted, IF the possibility of fourth breeding ever came around, it would still be a long time before Adelle would even be trying as I still have a few major points to finish up on Neva's side.

And if fourth breedings were brought in, they could be as hard to get as eldership, maxed stats for both partners in the pair, an application process, only offered a couple times a year, etc. etc. just so it's kept rare and hard to get, but it could be a potential for plotters/rper's who have really good plots that could end a certain plot point and be an end of one but the start of another.

Either way, it's completely up to the staff, and whatever the decision I won't mind in the least. 8D

/once more.... personal opinion/

Haha.... I suppose that is right. However for what you want for Adelle I must say that just because she doesn't carry the babies doesn't mean that she doesn't get a chance to do the plot you want or thought up in 'make believe' land.... in many ways it's almost like a C-section over a natural birth. They say C-section kids and mothers don't bond the same (a load of rubbish if you asked me, Jasper is more bonded than his sister at times haha) but anyways in my mind it would almost be like that.... two different ways of being born but both just as valid and they both give you the same end result.... you are still a mother. Haha. Scary parts and all.

The thing is with this 'application' process....
a) who is doing it?
b) is everyone allowed to try even if their pet hasn't used all their breedings? Just like with RP qualification?
c) what exactly are we talking about for these 'hard criteria'?

In terms of point b, I both think it would be unfair to exclude anyone the opportunity and both riddiculous to allow anyone who doesn't have a maxed soquili to enter... my point being that things change, and at the rate it takes to get one breeding let alone several for the same soquili things will likely be completely different by the time they reach the point to have said awarded fourth.
I genuinely think it is just too mess to be practical.

Sorry... not trying to kick anyone in the teeth or anything. <3

Kamiki

Alternatively, or additionally, I think Elders should get 4 baskets by default, as opposed to 3 (/w4th as an option). At this point, I think every Elder breeding has had 4, but imagine how disappointing now it would be to the couple to get 3 baskets do to a stoke of bad luck?

I agree with this. Especially since eldership has become a lot harder to obtain. A guarentee of four for an elder would be awesome.  

[pippi18848]

Syaoran-Puu

/once more.... personal opinion/

Haha.... I suppose that is right. However for what you want for Adelle I must say that just because she doesn't carry the babies doesn't mean that she doesn't get a chance to do the plot you want or thought up in 'make believe' land.... in many ways it's almost like a C-section over a natural birth. They say C-section kids and mothers don't bond the same (a load of rubbish if you asked me, Jasper is more bonded than his sister at times haha) but anyways in my mind it would almost be like that.... two different ways of being born but both just as valid and they both give you the same end result.... you are still a mother. Haha. Scary parts and all.

The thing is with this 'application' process....
a) who is doing it?
b) is everyone allowed to try even if their pet hasn't used all their breedings? Just like with RP qualification?
c) what exactly are we talking about for these 'hard criteria'?

In terms of point b, I both think it would be unfair to exclude anyone the opportunity and both riddiculous to allow anyone who doesn't have a maxed soquili to enter... my point being that things change, and at the rate it takes to get one breeding let alone several for the same soquili things will likely be completely different by the time they reach the point to have said awarded fourth.
I genuinely think it is just too mess to be practical.

Sorry... not trying to kick anyone in the teeth or anything. <3

Pfft, no kicking in of teeth at all. I enjoy a good discussion. 8D

While wishing star could work in that way, with Adelle being my first Soq, my first soq to be maxed out in breedings, the matriarch of my family, mother of Neva, I'm just horribly horribly picky and particular about things and wishing star just wouldn't be the same for how I'd like it to work out if I did go along with that plot idea.

As far as who would run it, whoever wanted to among the staff or whoever was able to.
I think in the case of if their pet hasn't had a chance to use all their breedings, but their partner has, that could be where it would get messy. Unless the pair was lifemated so there wouldn't be that whole complicated mess of people just throwing pairs together for a chance at an extra slot or what have you. Could be something to work out. In a way it might even encourage people to be a bit more accepting of lifemating their soq who hasn't used all their breedings, with someone who has and the poor maxed out soqs aren't quite so shunned.
But like, with the elderships or even the skinwalker cursings, you have to essentially prove that they are deserving of it, be it via rp's, extensive plotting written out in story format[for those that are busy and have a hard time getting out a few rp's, but a couple of rp's would still be required.], or something of the sort. These special slots could be opened up just a couple times a year similar to the elder slots. -snorts- Like if one opening was around valentine's, cupid got a couple of super strong arrows and accidentally shot them at pairs, and well, magic happened, and voila pregnancies! Obviously normal breedings take priority, but if this was only just a rare couple of times during the year, I don't see how it could take away the focus from normal breedings. Especially since I don't think there are a gazillion soqs that are maxed out, so just a couple times a year having some sort of special openings would be more than enough. Would also show those that are truly dedicated in getting that special breeding if they were only a couple times a year.

Whoot! I'm rambling. I apologize, my thoughts keep going off track. Yay for being distracted by kitties.  

[Syaoran-Puu]

pippi18848

Pfft, no kicking in of teeth at all. I enjoy a good discussion. 8D

While wishing star could work in that way, with Adelle being my first Soq, my first soq to be maxed out in breedings, the matriarch of my family, mother of Neva, I'm just horribly horribly picky and particular about things and wishing star just wouldn't be the same for how I'd like it to work out if I did go along with that plot idea.

As far as who would run it, whoever wanted to among the staff or whoever was able to.
I think in the case of if their pet hasn't had a chance to use all their breedings, but their partner has, that could be where it would get messy. Unless the pair was lifemated so there wouldn't be that whole complicated mess of people just throwing pairs together for a chance at an extra slot or what have you. Could be something to work out. In a way it might even encourage people to be a bit more accepting of lifemating their soq who hasn't used all their breedings, with someone who has and the poor maxed out soqs aren't quite so shunned.
But like, with the elderships or even the skinwalker cursings, you have to essentially prove that they are deserving of it, be it via rp's, extensive plotting written out in story format[for those that are busy and have a hard time getting out a few rp's, but a couple of rp's would still be required.], or something of the sort. These special slots could be opened up just a couple times a year similar to the elder slots. -snorts- Like if one opening was around valentine's, cupid got a couple of super strong arrows and accidentally shot them at pairs, and well, magic happened, and voila pregnancies! Obviously normal breedings take priority, but if this was only just a rare couple of times during the year, I don't see how it could take away the focus from normal breedings. Especially since I don't think there are a gazillion soqs that are maxed out, so just a couple times a year having some sort of special openings would be more than enough. Would also show those that are truly dedicated in getting that special breeding if they were only a couple times a year.

Whoot! I'm rambling. I apologize, my thoughts keep going off track. Yay for being distracted by kitties.

You see this is where I take issue with the idea.....

...So the 'special slots' are open only to those who have a maxed out pet, which means they have in the past (not counting or considering how many years it took for it to happen or how long ago their last breeding was) had three breedings. Fact. And suddenly they get the chance at having another one in their own special breeding opening, in a slot that is likely going to be less competative than the current low luck list... sure, it might be set with 'hard standards' but that still means less competition.... when there are people who are desperate for their first breeding, or for a couple they have been trying for years with to finally get their chance at being pregnant. To me it just seems... unfair... and to be honest, a little greedy. I think the only way I would ever accept it as a valid and fair idea would be if the slots were opened but just because you are selected for the honour doesn't mean you get a breeding... you then have to try for slots in regular breedings just like everyone else. Which obviously once again leads to the problem of 'oh which couple from this list should I decide to enter this time?'.... haha... meh. I am more than aware of how slow going it can be to get through a list of excited wannnabe parents.

As for 'show those that are truly dedicated in getting that special breeding' well... isn't that what the RP slots are all about? Ok, so a maxed out soquili can't enter any more... but still! I do not understand or see why someone who has likely got grandkiddies and perhaps great-grand-kiddies and more suddenly feels like they deserve/need another shot. Don't get me wrong, from a plot standing I can see the possibility for interesting ideas and things to occur but it will surely just encourage the whole 'mating plots' only..... what about everything else? Plus, if you look at humans there is a time when you can no long reproduce, menapause kicks in and men start firing blanks... you can't just keep going forever and ever; and I am going to assume those with large generation families are pretty old by this point, even for make believe horses.

Like I said from the start... I really just think it is too messy and complicated. On the surface it seems simple and rather straight forward to manage and undertake but hey... you step into the water and suddenly you're drowning.

And haha... I enjoy a good discussion too <3

/personal opinion/  

[Looneytaz82]

Looneytaz82

Just adding my .02!

What if it was not tied to elders at all, and more to the 100% stats. This way the fourth breeding gives those that RP the opportunity... It means that owners have to work really hard to get it. It could be worked so that both Soq must be at 100%, that way it shows that the "family" has built up to it... This way those that are unable to gain elder status, either by breed or by RP (such as a follower) could get a perk of their hard work.

It could also be classified as another slot for those that have obtained that status, so the 4th breeding would open up similar to when elder positions open up. This keeps it something a bit more special, and as a perk, rather than just an extra breeding slot.

In all honesty though, I'd like to see normal RP slots more available before we expand to more breeding slots.

Soooooo.....

After reading the post here for and against the idea, I have to flip flop a bit... (Maybe clarify my initial ideas)

I thought it would be cool as an RP perk for 100% stats, but it sounds that obtaining 100% stats is a bit easier that I imagined, going by someones idea about 2 posts a month gaining the 10% boost... (not officially of course).

While the fourth breeding wold be a great perk for RPing, I would simply LOVE to see more RP slots open or those that are trying...  

[tefla]

I'm going to go and say that I disagree with the idea of there being an extra perk for achieving elder status. (or even intensive RPed Soquili)

The reason for which I state my preference is that Soquili has always been a 3 breeding win limit for any Soquili. It has been that way since I joined the shop in '09. I don't like it when things suddenly change. Am I afraid of change then ... yes. But the system has always worked well as it is.

I say leave the number of breeding wins at 3 for everyone involved. It would make things easier on the staff. There would be no tracking down who needs what and so forth.  

[Sabin Duvert]

if this idea were implemented (and it sounds like the general consensus is against it, so it might be moot - I would think that it would have to just be an across the board thing offered for soquili with 100% stats. No special slots, no extra time required of the staff to have to judge one vs another. Yeah, it's true, it doesn't take TERRIBLY long to get to 100% for a soquili - but it's still 9 - 10 months of dedicated RPng for the soquili. And certainly no special raffle slots. It would just be up to the owner whether or not to enter that soquili or a different couple into the raffle. So yeah, I don't think it would affect the number of couples shooting for breeding slots - just make the decision that much harder for the owner.

But yeah, I do think that a guarantee of 4 foals for elder breedings isn't a bad idea. Especially since all elder breedings up to now have yielded 4 baskets.  

[Faid Shadowlight]

*Tosses in 2 cents*

I have to say while I'm all for perks to encourage more rp and whatnot I really hate this idea. Big NO vote from me.

When I look at my breeding history and the couples I have had.... Not to mention the plots and familys that have developed around my pets. I made those plans knowing full well that I had only 3 breedings, and sure I've had to accept that to do at least 1 plot I will need a Wish breeding or (as the plot was made before those) to custom a kid for the plot. But it was my choice to do that, and I did so knowing the concequences.

That said I have soquili that are... technically... old with large familys that have not even met a mate yet, let alone had a single breeding. But then thats what adoption does for you, they adopted, the kids had kids, and so on... I have some great fun with those soquili cause the family is often talking about setting them up.... (matchmaking hilatiry ftw!)

Either way back to the point. Which is that getting even 1 breeding can take 2 years or more... In 4 years 5 of my soquili have had kids.... 1 batch of kids.
That gets knocked down to 4 as 1 of those was a Wish breeding between 2 males. and 1 more taken off as that was a SC breeding from Sya between one of our pairs. So 3 breedings in 4 years... not even one a year.... So even IF I had entered the same couple for all 3 times I would only just have 1 valid couple for this.

Now I know some are more lucky, I have seen people win slots 2 or 3 months in a row... Others are even less lucky than me. but if that math is even close to a store average then really those that are maxed out have been very lucky or have been around a long time... or both...

Ok rambling a lot.... My point is that I cannot see a way for this to be done without upsetting more than one apple cart. And honestly I don't think greed should be encouraged. If its a rp perk (which seems to be what all this is about) Then you made the choice for the plot and should face that there are limited ways to carry it off... And if you Rp for the love of rp and not for the stats and extra basket you can get, then enjoy your characters, old and new.. and Yes let them get old... you don't have to kill the off but dotage could be something different to play.

Besides if you have a maxed out soquili why are you still creating plots that require breedings? I know this is a fantasy world, but it has some rules that require realism in rp and mares in reality will stop being able to breed some time between 16 and 28 years old... And sure in a lifetime a mare can have many foals but they do it one at a time usually, and with all creatures, humans included, the older you are the more risk there is in breeding for mother and child.

Sorry for the rambling and if my point of view upsets anyone.  

[Kamiki]

LydaLynn

You're right - the chances are already very good in your favor for 4. Which is why I think 4 should go ahead and be a guarantee. If you're an elder and you're breeding with a Soquili that has less than 100% stats, then you still may end up with 3. Maybe you're breeding partner has a really good plotline with your Soquili, but doesn't have the time or muse to RP it out?

Even if the chance is small - could you imagine how disappointing it would be to be the first couple with an Elder breeding to get 3 baskets because of a really crappy roll? I won't lie, I would be.

Since Eldership is already a pretty lofty goal to obtain, and you're chances are already tipped over to the 4th basket anyway, going ahead and saying "If you're an Elder, your breedings yield 4 baskets" I think wouldn't change the status quo (all elder breedings have already had 4) and it will spare any possible feelings later for a bad roll of the die. /2 cents