{S} Reexamining LL Customs

[Kamiki]

Maybe Cosplays could be allowed in the rolling list, but not CC'd? Would be a good compromise? Some people really love their cosplays, would be tough to not allow them at all.  

[Andranis]

That DOES sound a good compromise 3nodding But maybe limit how many cosplays, too, can be posted for in one person's post. So say they have 5 forms... Only 1-2 can be cosplays.  

[Kamiki]

Oh, I like limited it to 1-2 cosplays per person. Keep people from just filling their forms up with popular characters (Like the entire cast of MLP, for example), but still lets people go for a Cosplay they really want  

[Sabin Duvert]

Yeah, cosplays has been the break down point for people with the idea of customs months. Since you have to post forms publically and things are at least partially CC'd (even if you're raffled).

Some proposals have bene that you send the forms at the begining of the month to a certain staff member, who then posts everything on the same account anonymously. BUT that sounds... really overly complicated, and doesn't allow for editing of forms i you change your mind mid-month.

And it becomes more of the first person who actually sent in the form for a cosplay allowed to try for it, and it still telegraphs that a certain charater is being gone after.

one... suggestion... would be that people could optionally post a shortened form like "I'm going for a cosplay, it's X breed, Y level of edits" and if you are rolled, you can PM the colorist with who your concept is for them to choose. Maybe you could even if you wanted list the series it's from (So the colorist might pick something they recognize). (But that implies a delay between rolling and the colorist allowed to start on your concept). But the person could also choose to just outright post the full form if they wanted?  

[In Good Faith]

Andranis

I like this idea overall, and especially breaking it down into categories. For how it would work, I do have an idea. If a person can link to proof they're low luck in a specific category(Say 40 tries in Super Rare), then they get an extra ticket in the raffle. It increases their chance at winning the custom, and after the initial 40, every 10 attempts gets them another extra ticket. Of course, even if the low luck number is 20 like breedings, an extra ticket could still be given for every 10 more attempts failed. So... You have 37 failed attempts, and pretending they're all Super Rare, 37 attempts would place you at three tickets for the next customs raffle. If that makes sense?

As for the CC customs, I remember the thread discussing that one, and I bring back a suggestion I made that, while not popular, is still a rather valid worry - Maybe cosplays of official media(IE, comics, games, movies, etc.) should be not permitted, to keep things fair. That was a worry brought up in the last "CC customs" thread, of a colorist picking a friend over someone else for the same cosplay custom. As an example, Person A and Person B both want a cosplay of Twilight Sparkle. Person A is either a newbie, semi-newbie, or a more passive Soquili member, while Person B is a friend/relative of Colorist 1. Because of either friendship or relation, Colorist 1 may pick Person B over Person A to get the cosplay of Twilight Sparkle. That's the other big worry about favoritism in CC customs.

I very much love the idea for extra tickets for (edited to clarify) every LL milestone, so to say. My brain is on the business stats class zone is I think that this concept is GREAT.



As for favoritism mentioned before (in the thread in general, not just this post) I think that for every 5 rolled, 1 CC. Favoritism really irks me, and if there were a way to make concepts anonymous, I would completely suggest it. Bribes can't be helped with favoritism, other than DD's example of restrictions with the limit of 2 customs, 1 breeding. So I think even more restrictions should be used when the event isn't bribes. ; 3;  

[Theidren]

Love these ideas!!


I think that if people were limited on what they could win, like has been pointed out, that would take care of the favoritism some are concerned with. Just my opinion smile  

[Phail Ninja]

hanging gallow

Custom month with the similar idea with a few exceptions. One being you can only win once due to custom cool down. Two instead of colorist ccing all the ones they want they would have to roll one, finish it, then cc one, finish it, roll one finish it and that be the pattern. OR if they to do 10 for the month then they have to roll five and then can cc five, something along those lines. This way there is always a chance of a person getting the custom they want and not worry about if its exactly what the colorist wanted to do, and then changing it to fit their "please pick me." It might even be nice for members if they want to post five forms and if they are rolled the colorist can pick one of the five that they feel comfortable with, or if the member has one they really want they just post that one. If they are multiple colorists, then a pref list maybe?

I think a lot of it is just people want their customs made, and I feel like giving a full bribe month with just CC isn't the best solution for it. As Blind pointed out there are plenty of people who do enter and enter bribes that want their particular soquili and they don't get CC'd and they do get discouraged a lot and it sucks. I also know colorist like bribes because they can pick the designs they like so maybe half roll and half cc would be a better solution.

Just saying, this ^.^ I'm not complaining or whatever, but I know to some people it was very disheartening seeing some people get multiple concepts picked via CC while they basically didn't have a chance because their custom idea wasn't the colourist's bundle of roses. Bribe months ARE awesome, but this would be a nice alternative as well.  

[CheshireKttty]

First of all, I don't think Bribes should be brought into this. They're a completely different category and if there are complaints there a different thread should be brought up. That being said, DD worked her butt off and only picked a few people twice. Yes it sucked that some people weren't chosen, but it was still amazing of her to get so many ponies done.

As for ACTUAL customs, I've never won a custom slot. I was gifted my first ever custom as a birthday present by a colorist and was picked in DD's bribes. (Been in the shop and trying since 2008-9ish?)

I think it would have to be noted whether or not gifts/bribes would count towards slots and would probably depend on the colorists.

Basically, I'm all for Custom LL slots or even just Custom newbie slots. Once again though, this is probably going to come down to colorists actually wanting to do those slots and how they decide to do them. Though seeing more custom slots in general would be nice. However I realize the colorists have a lot on their plate and we seem to be pretty short staffed on active colorists at the moment.  

[Kamiki]

Personally, I think ANY full custom should reset your LL counter.

I also agree Bribes are completely separate things. Bribes are something a colorist has to turn in credits for - its mean to be a -reward- so they should be able to CC to their heart's desire.

But if the shop does a sponsored "Custom Month" again then that's where CCs should be restricted imho

 

[Laroawan]

I think a basic link to 20+ custom slots you have attempted would suffice for qualification. Then you have proof and it's pretty easy to track or at least no harder than LL breeding as they are still all in the custom forum.  

[stella cinere]

First off no one is saying DD didn't work her butt off on bribes and no one is mad at her for it.

Second of all that was the point of it. Bribes are different and are run differently and no one wants to make the colorist have to change how they do bribes. What is being said is that it would be great to do customs like bribe month but for customs where picking twice doesn't come into play. Favoritism was why month customs were closed in the first place not the bribes. Lastly with so few customs slots with the bribe slots it felt like the only chance at the custom and seeing people win twice was disheartening for those who didn't win so it was slightly discouraging not that it was DD fault and that feeling would have been the same regardless of colorist. Just it says that maybe we should do the same month thing with customs if that would be more of an interest for colorist and members. (Because part of the perk of being able to CC bribes is that they can CC them)

Niss mentioned spoiler tags, maybe spoiler tags would be nice vs limiting how many forms you have in.

I understand the whole cosplay issue sad unfort I don't know a whole lot of solution other than limiting how many you can put in form...

As for winning slots I've been a member of soquili since 2005 and I have only won one custom slot in that time. That was Fel's LL/Newbie custom slots and she CC'd my sister and I custom in 2010. I have never won a bribe never was gifted from colorist a custom or etc. So I understand a bit of the frustration in not winning sad  

[Nyx Queen of Darkness]

I think LL customs is...a reasonable idea. But, I think it should be stipulated that you can only apply for what you've been going for.

The reason I say this, is someone could have been trying for an OC for 2 years (makes up numbers) and 22 tries. They win LL custom because of amount of tries, but instead of getting their OC they get a cosplay because they are on a shortened list.

Now, this doesn't really matter if the custom ISN"T a cosplay--I'd be fine with just numbers there or amount of tries or whatever. And it's terrible, but there are always people who will try to exploit something. So I think in the case of Cosplays at least you should be able to provide 20 links for just THAT cosplay (or wahtever the decided number is).

But in case of non-cosplays, it could be more lenient--say just amount of tries overall or amount of tries in a category.

I hope that made sense, I just got home and I'm kind of tired.  

[LOLTERNATIVE]

On LL customs: Yeah, I think this should be a thing. However, I think staff credits and bribes should reset your list. I mean; you were willing to pay to bribe to get something YOU specifically wanted - it's a custom and other people didn't get a chance to do so. Same goes with staff credits - not attacking staffers for using their credits - but if someone gets a custom via credits it's even better than winning in bribes or customs because 1) it was free and 2) you didn't have to beat the odds.

A couple's breeding LL is reset if they win via bribe / staff credits so I think the same rule should apply for a custom LL. I mean, as it is, bribes (excluding the last two months) aren't a common occurrence and when they were (prior to Mind and DD being awesome) they weren't that big.

That might not have made much sense but yolo.

I don't think there should be any 'prove you've been trying for this custom/cosplay' rule. You should have your 20 links period. You can't reserve cosplays and I don't think anyone should be excluded for trying for a cosplay. If they reached LL status and then suddenly got into Harry Potter and wanted a Harry Potter cosplay they should be allowed to go for it - regardless of other people questing the pony. They paid their dues waiting for the slot. Let them use it however they want. There's always going to be multiple people questing the same cosplay and people are always going to be disappointed. But we shouldn't start punishing people for not questing it as actively as others because that seems like borderline cosplay reserve to me. You're reserving the cosplay for the peope who have been questing it.

On Customs Month:

I think people are putting too much thought into this / trying to make it more complicated than it needs to be. I think customs month should be just that. A thread is set up maybe 2 weeks prior to rolling for everyone to have plenty of time to post their forms. Once the 2 weeks are up, colourists begin rolling from the list. I think CC should be kept to a minimum; just to make it fair for those that have odd tastes. Maybe every 5th custom can be CC'd. Once you win your custom - that's it. Regular custom rules. You can only win ONCE period. For that month, colourists do as many customs as they can and I really love DD's rules for bribes where she wasn't allowed to pick up another bribe until she had finished her first one. I think that would be a great way to do this and then at the end of the month they could pick x number of customs to work on.

I would love to see a custom newbie list for this as well. Someone who has won 0 customs.  

[CheshireKttty]

I don't really see that as reserving cosplays. Someone could still come in and get the cosplay while you're on the LL. It's just giving you a 'slightly' better chance because you've already tried for that same cosplay 20+ times or whatever.

Also I wouldn't think it'd be too bad to do LL tries towards specific customs. My reasoning for this is that with Breedings you get it per pair. Not just that you've entered breedings 20+ times. That way if you're going for say an uncommon custom and have been entering all customs that you could enter but then a 'mini only' custom pops up, you won't have to sit it out for fear of resetting your counter. Especially with as few and far between as customs are.

As far as staff credits and such is going, it'd probably be up to the colorist to choose how to do it. But if staff credits count then it should count for staff buying themselves ponies as well.  

[Nyx Queen of Darkness]

It's not about reserving cosplays. It's about fairness.

I don't believe that it would be fair to entitle someone to a much smaller list and then allow them to get a cosplay they hadn't tried for. It would give them an unfair advantage of getting it--increasing their odds over everyone else.

For that matter, I've reconsidered. I think you should have to go for the same custom you tried for or same category.

Because what if a colourist runs a LL customs and rolls five people. If there are no stipulations on what they can get (same category, same character, etc) then the colourist might wind up doing five angeni slots because the winners want to take advantage of their win.

Just like it would be grossly unfair for your breeding LL counter to be for ANY couple you had just because you're LL. Because if there are no stipulations a colourist could get stuck with five mega-mutant breedings that no one tried breeding before, but were entitled to just because they were LL.