[Answered] Allowing minor mutations in customs

[Andranis]

Please note, I am not being unappreciative - I've adored looking at all the ponies that were just given out even if I didn't have time to join even half the games and was only able to join a few. The re-opening event was very fun smile Thank you for the great event, staff heart

Okay, so... I know that a lot of people are frustrated that they can't get pawed mutants or purewalkers in regular customs, even if they're asked to pay a hefty price, and I know staff don't want to allow it and exactly why, period. But this isn't about paws or claws or custom wings.

Currently, anything considered non-equine is dubbed a mutation(And... Some equine? I think donkey ears are considered a mutation for some reason... I may be wrong, though!). From customs:

MUTANT
• Mane/tail/hair made of something other than hair (fire/smoke/ice) EDIT BY MIND: This is NOT a mutation, it's an Ulun'suti Trait depending on their element
• Fetlocks which are not hair - winglets (for non-Angeni/Angeni crosses), spikes, etc.
• Face and body spikes EDIT BY MIND: This is NOT a mutation, it's an Ulun'suti Trait
• non-equid ears
• Eastern Dragon type whiskers, tentacles
• "Animal" tail - feline, canine, etc.
• New: Multiple tails (ie, any more than one tail)
• Non-Wind, Kalona wings, Or Ulun'suti (, clockwork wings, etc)
• non-equine heads Example: Leviathan EDIT BY MIND: Leviathan pretty much has a hippogryph lip-beak.
• Untemplated Cursed Skinwalker (non-canine or feline that would require a custom pelt)
• New: A mis-matched pair of wings. ((Ie, one wing of one species, the "mate" to that wing being that of a different breed of soquili)).
• New: With the exception of flutters, it requires a mutant slot to get uniquely drawn wings, even if they follow breed standards

Now obviously, that's not the WHOLE thing - What's irrelevant to this - Paws and claws - was left out(By the way, mis-matched wings is listed twice...). Some of these features are fairly intensive, like the wings. So, this STARTS to bring me to my point..

I'm gonna diverge a moment and point out that extreme edits cost 1mil on top of the base custom price... For a mutant feature, something like fox ears are actually fairly low-key compared to uber-complex hair, with uber-complex horse clothes, etc. - Come to think of it, I've only seen one colorist even LIST an Extreme Edit... And it was also a mutant. So this begs the question, why have the tier...?

Well, why not repurpose the tier to include some fairly minor mutations? Such as fox/wolf/rabbit ears, dragon whiskers, SOME body spikes, etc. - LITTLE things, and kept within a limited number, IE... "You can only have up to 4 minor mutations."

So, I have a character I'd like to get as a Soquili, but the character is a fox... And I want her to have the ears and tail. If the ears are considered a MINOR mutations that's permitted, I can get her an item edit to LOOK like she has the tail, without actually having a tail or crossing into full mutant status. A non-equine nose could also be called a minor mutation, so there's two out of four.

Something like tails, and things like wings, would remain in full mutant status with paws and claws, but why not let us have just small LITTLE things as MINOR mutation edits, even if we're paying 1mil to get them? smile  

[Sabin Duvert]

If mutations become allowed in customs, I think that the edit level should be independent from breed (mutant). For example, like you said, minor mutation edits (like wolf or fox ears) would be in line with the work that goes into existing minor edits (facial expression changes, small items, etc)

But adding a "mutant" flag would be a separate cost [1M? 5M like an uber-rare? IDK], kind of like a breed or cross breed.

On that line, you could always just make it so if mutations were opened up, not qualifying what is or isn't a "minor" mutation (as long as it's not a megamutant - which is pretty clearly defined) - just what edit level the colorist is comfortable doing, like always.

Non-flutter custom wings (and more recently custom scales) have always been the only feature(s) qualified as "mutant" even though ICly they fit breed standard because of complexity. I'd say (again IF) mutants became customizable in shop, to just flag wings and scales as an extreme edit bullet in the edit system we already have in place and, like always, colorists have the option of only doing up to heavily edited soquili or, like with the 'suti elemental traits allowed, just say they aren't comfortable with doing that kind of trait in general.


That list, granted, (I know it's pulled from the custom info thread) needs to be updated, since some of those features like elemental hair/fetlocks is now allowable if the soquili is at least part 'suti.

EDIT - in sum, I think if mutants are opened up to be customizable, I don't think we need to further subdivide what is or isn't allowable - it would just be more confusing, beyond possibly No to purewalkers and megamutants. Let the existing edit level system with the bullets cover the complexity [wings, scales or custom pelts would definitely be extreme edits, which colorists do not have to take at all]. And being a mutant at all would come with an added cost (up to the shop) just like being a crossbreed.  

[Kettyn]

I sadly would have to say that I don't think this is a good idea. That is all I will say on the matter.  

[Yeonn]

Normally dont get into these topics but i dont really like this idea and i wanted to say that.

I would rather not loose a chance for a extreme edited soq just so there might be a chance at mutations.  

[mindsend]

Hey guys! Just wanting to state that Uta, Mal, and I are already discussing the possibility of introducing mutant customs outside of bribes, but not into standard customs: we're still at the beginning stages of it so it'll be a while before we have any real information for you, especially since we have higher priority things we're working on (Such as cleaning up all the information to prevent confusion). But this does make this feedback thread redundant since it's something already being actively discussed.

HOWEVER There is some mild confusion due to the fact that we're in the process of cleaning up old outdated lists (there are so many of them we tend to miss one at times) and they haven't been updated yet: these things take time and thus we're going to need some patience, especially since we're getting to them again now that the shop has become active again. The spring cleaning is taking time, but there are several traits listed here as 'mutant' that are far from it, and other things have things that can be done to mimic it.

Quote:

The following traits are NOT Mutations

Mane/tail/hair made of something other than hair (fire/smoke/ice): This is an Ulun'suti trait Depending on their Element. Hippogryphs can have feathers. Quilin/quilin mixes can have swirly whispy forms coming from their ankles/along the back of their legs as a form of fetlocks (also, while not a fetlock, Kelpi/Mers/Seathi/ nixie have leg fins.

Fetlocks which are not hair : Suti can have elemental fetlocks (And spikes), Hippogryphs can have feather fetlocks.

Face and body spikes: This on its own is an Ulun'suti trait



Example given is no longer accurate and there are exceptions to the rule

Eastern Dragon type whiskers: While not allowed on Full sized soquili, this is a Quilin Trait. Also, Mer's are allowed catfish/angler fish style whiskers
addition: Tentacles Vine hair on a Wood Ulun'suti can be tentacle-like.

non-equine heads Example: Leviathan: While this is still a mutation in some cases (dog muzzles, hippo heads, etc are megamutants) there are exceptions to this rule, and Leviathan does count for it as they have a Hippogryph Lip-beak. Ulun'suti also have the option for a more predatory jawline, making their faces more dragonic. They are not mutants for their beaks or jaws.

You can fake it without being a mutation

"Animal" tail - feline, canine, etc. Some larger Cerynei tails look mildly like a canine tail, and as long as its 'thinner at the base and poofier at the tip" unicorn tails can be fluffier like a cat.. The longer hair's at the tip (and can run a little down the underside of the tail). Ulun'suti have lizardlike tails and are serpentine. One can braid a hair tail to look like that of a rat. Hippogryphs feathers can be used to mimic a fox tail etc layered shaggy tails can mimic cat tails in appearances

Non-Wind, Kalona wings, Or Ulun'suti (, clockwork wings, etc) Clockwork 'wings' can be made by using armor on real wings. Tribal marking wings can be done by having markings on a flutter set of wings

Multiple tails (ie, any more than one tail) : A hair tail in two braids. Hippogryphs feathers can be used to mimic kitsune tails

non-equid ears: Hair can be styled to mimic things. Some examples
Tufts of hair to mimic cat ears
Braided hair/Bundled hair to look like puppydog/Poodle ears