*nods* it was more a random thought/query really, once you've got a few running around it's going to be hard to keep them as a cosplay while keeping it different from the other cosplays around ... depending on the character of course.
For example, a character that has several different outfits, those could be done easily, but once you've got those versions in circulation, it's going to be hard to get further versions of said cosplay without possibly infringing on someone else's design ... if i'm making sense? Then you would be looking at changing it too much and creating an OC instead of a cosplay.
I totally get you. It works a lot better for realistic characters, like those from TV shows or movies since real life people change their clothes, as long as you fall into the realm of something they'd wear, you're golden, but when you get into like video game characters and even some comic characters, it does make it harder to variate when they pretty much only have one set costume. Excellent question!
Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 6:00 am
To be honest, if this rule goes through, I honestly don't see there being that big of a problem with absolute duplicate soquili running around.
For one, custom slots are hard to get - and there are soooooo many awesome characters out there. I doubt you're going to see more than a small handfull of any given character out there. On top of that, even if for some reason two people describe the exact same design, you will probably have different colorists doing it - and everyone has their own style (I an usually ID the colorist behind a soquili, especially if it's edited). The hair will be drawn differently, even if it is in the same basic haircut, etc. Then on top of that there's the base furcolor to use (skincolor vs a natural horsecolor vs something based on the outfit the character wears), to how much of /what accessories or outfit pieces to use, whether or not to horse-ify some of the clothing pieces, if the character has different outfits, etc.
I do think that the needing to ask permission of original owners is not a good solution - it makes more work rather than less work. Ditto for allowing m/f and fullsize/mini of each character - if one of the reasons is to reduce the lists and research staff and customers have to do to see if something is available, then that makes things harder rather than easier.
I think Ryu brings up a good point about fostering a collaborative, encouraging environment rather than a competitive one when you have two people who are huge fans of the same series/character. When you have it so that only one person can get THAT character, it can foster some resentment between the people rather than celebrating a mutual love of the character.
I think it's true that getting a cosplay of a character in a breedables shop that your'e heavily involved in is kind of a way that some people can view of interacting with a fandom/character that they really love - and a small way that you can "own" a part of it. You're never going to own THAT character - because, by definition, you didn't create them. But you can own them - in soquili. And to the soquili community, you've become the representation of that character. I think that might be where some of the special snowflake desire comes from. Not saying it's right or wrong, but I think that that might be an underlying affect that is influencing some of the kickback against the concept. And maybe recognizing that is a first step of reconciling it and moving past that.
The more I think on this, the more I think I'm leaning to the side of letting this rule go through.
, but when you get into like video game characters and even some comic characters, it does make it harder to variate when they pretty much only have one set costume. Excellent question!
this is what i mean. One of those that comes to mind is Deadpool ... he's pretty much got one look/outfit that's about it.
Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:45 am
Revel1984
Kaitaia
, but when you get into like video game characters and even some comic characters, it does make it harder to variate when they pretty much only have one set costume. Excellent question!
this is what i mean. One of those that comes to mind is Deadpool ... he's pretty much got one look/outfit that's about it.
Different breeds, for one. Someone might picture Deadpool as a Kalona while someone else might picture him as a Suti.
Also, some people would want to get him in his head-to-toe type outside, a full body suit, if you will. While others don't like that "clothing on a pony" look so might instead get a carousel-like themed Soq using Deadpool's colors and cool face-markings instead of a mask.
And someone else still might go for the MLP look, where he's just a red pony with a chibi deadpool face on his rump.
EDIT:
Searching for "Deadpool MLP" brought up these different ponies:
Different breeds, for one. Someone might picture Deadpool as a Kalona while someone else might picture him as a Suti.
Also, some people would want to get him in his head-to-toe type outside, a full body suit, if you will. While others don't like that "clothing on a pony" look so might instead get a carousel-like themed Soq using Deadpool's colors and cool face-markings instead of a mask.
And someone else still might go for the MLP look, where he's just a red pony with a chibi deadpool face on his rump.
EDIT:
Searching for "Deadpool MLP" brought up these different ponies:
All Deadpool "MLP" but still pretty different.
firstly.. HAHAHAHAHAHA those Deapool MLP's ....
Even if you get them on a different species... the outfit and the overall design is pretty much similar/the same, it would be hard not to infringe on someone else's cosplay of him, even if you use a different species, the edits and costume design are pretty much the same.
Edit - Also pretty much all the Species share a basic lineart, with edits added onto that base to make them said species (barring mer, seathi, usdia in that, if we're using a male regular sized soq as an example) They'd all still essentially look the same, just with the species edits added on.
Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:59 am
I guess to me they don't look the same at all. I mean, yeah you can tell they have the same inspiration, but they have different breed features, different hairstyles (or lack thereof), different "cutie marks", different weapons...
...and thats all just going the MLP style. You could easily get a more natural horse like look. For example, you picture Deadpool as a black horse with red hair. Or human-skin colored with a body suit on.
Its all the same concept as people who want a "white tiger" Soquili. They all are white tigers underneath is all, but its their hair/breeds/accessories that make them unique.
I would agree with Kamiki, those all look vastly different to me. There are so many possible takes on a cosplay, even one as limited as Deadpool. Plus, I doubt there would be heaps of any one character - it's just too hard to acquire customs! xP
Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 9:09 am
*giggles*
As for 'the same', Technically all the original harpies are the same base... with different colors XD So I mean, there are many definitions/view points of 'the same', but yeah XD;;
Wildlife bases (including fantasy ones) are essentially the same as well, but still different o3o
/BAD EXPLANATION XD;
I guess what I'm kind of saying is that cosplays will vary a lot depending on the initial designer of the pony o3o I mean, even if it was the same, if you gave... for example, Mind and I the same exact picture to replicate, we'd still do it different ways xD
/doesn't care much about the cosplay title, just posting stuff xD;
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Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 9:36 am
As everyone said, I don't think that there's much cause for concern over carbon copies. I doubt there's going to be a huge rush to custom the same characters, and even if there is, no colorist will execute the designs the same, even if they were working from the same form. Not to mention that they certainly wouldn't be working from the same form in the first place! Really, I think the most likely scenario is that old cosplays that no one has seen in years may be customed again, or that simply the amount of competition over cosplays will diminish. And remember, most people have many customs that they would like to get. If cosplays were suddenly to become more available via this means, I suspect people would put priority on other quests that perhaps they have had for longer. That is, however, only a prediction.
Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 10:10 am
I know I am primarily a Lurker in Soq, but I do love the shop and have since it first started many years ago. I have seen the custom cosplays and I have loved seeing how intricate they have gotten over the years.
I agree that this new implementation is a good idea. It gives newcomers a chance to get their desired character. If you think about it. The people who already have cosplays will have "The First" of that cosplay. Its kinda like the rare pets as a hunter in world of warcraft. Everyone can get them, but you could get it first. I know two years later I am still looking for terrorpene while a friend of mone found him right away when she hit 85. We both have karoma (the spirit wolf) I tamed him first then helped her get hers. I think its nice because then you can talk about how they compare to each other. Think of the fun it could bring. You could rp the same character together and they could totally hate each other. Lols they could have very different personalities and it could be alot of fun!
I am very much on board with this Change. I think it is very newbie friendly and welcoming. Its like saying "come get your favorite cosplay with us! And chat while you are at it!"
Personally, I really like this idea. While there are some expressing their concern over several characters who are going to look alike, to me, you need to adress the fact of the personality. These look-alikes can come from anywhere, all over the character's timelines. In that thought, from different points on timelines, characters' personalities grow and change, and start to differ.
Now while I agree that it might be odd to see soq who look alike trotting around, each may be different! While maybe not in looks, everyone has different takes on personality, on what makes that character themselves, so all in all, I think this is a great idea~!
Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 7:35 pm
( I haven't backread everything yet so sorry if I'm retreading anything) Just to get my say out in the open, I'm for this 100%.
I've felt that the cosplay rule is grossly outdated these days, and I've urged many of my friends and acquaintances to abandon the practice when starting new shops. Even though I play my Anzu as an AU version of his WoW Boss self there could easily be other AU versions that take him in an entirely different direction. When I first thought of the whole thing in terms of letting other people access the character (beyond the mount version) I was reluctant. Anzu's my baby and I've spent waaaayyyy too much time looking up any lore I could find to try and translate to his pony persona.
But really? If someone decided to get Anzu again then they don't have to meet or even acknowledge each other's existence in the soq universe. So what if breeding means their genetic lines cross down the road. I never have to have them meet if that makes me fidgety. The character is still the same character and I'm not against seeing other people's takes on that.
Really? My only issue left is that I paid a princely sum for the right to own the ONLY Anzu Boss back in the day and while I had zero issues letting other folks have raven lords I admit I would feel a bit cheated paying so much for that character when I could have waited a few years and bought something very similar for the smallest fraction of what I paid. x__x
But, as I said. Do it. I think it's better for everyone if this rule is abolished.
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Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 7:48 pm
Kaitaia
but when you get into like video game characters and even some comic characters, it does make it harder to variate when they pretty much only have one set costume. Excellent question!
I tried to think of a character who had the simplest design and the fewest official interpretations.
Pacman Cosplays. (If the link doesn't work just google search for packman cosplays.) For such a simple concept the results are quite varied. I don't see limited official designs playing a huge roll in forcing people into making cosplay clones. 3nodding
Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:21 pm
sesshiyasha
I know I am primarily a Lurker in Soq
No no no no. <3 Hun, "lurker" or not, whether you (co)own a Soquili or not, if you like the shop and you're part of it (heck, even if you didn't like it but can present reasonable, civil explanations as to why), your opinion matters because either way, it's going to help the shop grow. I just want to point that out. Don't feel like your opinion might not matter regardless of whether you're active or not.
Anyway. I'm going to come clean: at first, I was really undecided and leaning heavily to the "no" side even though I have no cosplays, because I was thinking of the people that were here that can't voice an opinion, etc, "because that's how it is in any other shop I've seen that allows cosplays, if you don't get it, you suck it up and move on", and many other reasons that have even been mentioned in the thread itself. It's a "social norm" in the BC community.
I've had a few days to think on it after my initial "oh god" moment and... I've changed my mind. I'm for making this change, without the need for a "permissions" list.
I've seen cosplays that I really wanted be held by inactive owners, I've seen cosplays I had a mind to try for gotten via other means. But those aren't the reasons I'd like to see this change be instated. And it's definitely not because I want to "stick it" to those that own the cosplays or disrespect the ones that got them first. I totally get and respect the sanctity and the reasons why people don't want a "duplicate"/same cosplay running around. In fact, I initially felt the same way, because I put myself in those people's shoes. "If I had [cosplay], would I want to see another person with it?" Well...no, because that cosplay is a special snowflake and it's mine. But then I felt rather selfish because I have been on the opposite side of the fence. "But I'd really like the opportunity to own [cosplay], too, and wouldn't it be nice if I didn't have to worry if it was already out of my reach because someone had the means and luck to get it? What would an opportunity like that mean to someone else?"
My biggest reason is that I'm tired of feeling like it's a "competition" and I'm tired of the disappointment and watching others be disappointed. I'd like the freedom to not have to cover up any cosplay ideas if I did decide to go for them, and not have to be restricted in the case that a cosplay I have in mind just isn't the same without paws, but I can't bribe for it (say if that rule were implemented)--not because I want to shut someone else out, but that's the ONLY way I can get a custom with four paws. And I haven't bothered to want to try for that or any cosplay because it's disheartening.
It's disheartening.
And because the cosplay section is so disheartening, I've really wanted nothing to do with it. If things were opened up would I go for a cosplay immediately? No, because I have so many other things I want to get for plotbunnies, etc, but eventually, hell. yes.
The restrictions on cosplays need to go. Lists are crazy in a shop with thousands of pets, be it a cosplay list or permissions list, both to create and maintain. And in the latter, for a permissions list, there would be a huge grey area because "what do we do if someone doesn't post, active or not? Is it right that they lose the "sole rights" to that cosplay?". There are more important things that that time and energy could be put towards, in my opinion.
I'd love for there to be a way for the "original" owners of the cosplays to not be hurt if someone gets another version of their cosplay, I really would, but a permissions list is just spiteful at the end of the day, because of the "it's a special snowflake and it's mine" at the bottom of it all. It's not that I don't respect that, because deep down, some part of me feels the same way...but it's about letting others have their cake/pie/treat of choice and eat it, too.
I'd like to simply post an observation: Fictional Wildlife has been open for all for about... Three years now. I don't think I've seen a single fictional wildlife custom that didnt follow the old fictional wildlife rules of opposite genders or shiny pokemon or what have you. I can't even convince people that "headscarfs" are an accessory they could design outside of certain families or cultures, I don't think people are exactly going to do a mad rush to get doubles since there is so much out there more important, like mockbreedings and custom mates and parents and siblings.
Additionally.. If you no longer had to try to get it first to still get it, how many people would keep their cosplays at the top of their quest list? Without the need to rush it, I think there would actually be fewer cosplays made since... Well.. Whats the rush?
